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Adding Groups or Stacks to Tweetie for Mac
I'm confident this isn't a new idea for you, but I would say the one thing that's keeping Tweetie from being the absolute skull crusher of a desktop client, is the need for Groups or Stacks that let you organize your tweeps into smaller, more manageable feeds. To an extent, I realize this is an API thing. But going from using Tweetdeck for the last 6 months, I'm finding myself scared, confused, and alone when looking at the overwhelmingly long timeline I have in Tweetie. Otherwise, this thing is a beautiful beautiful beast. Thanks!
I’m sad, anxious, confused, and a little hungry.
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Agreed. I tried the 2nd Twitter account fake group work-around. It confused the hell out of my followers, especially those with private updates, and was clunky as all get out. I reluctantly went back to hoping between Nambu and TweetDeck for the time being. In order to do without groups, I'd have to unfollow hundreds of people to get the main window down to a manageable volume.
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The "i'll pay for the app when feature X is added" is a non-starter. Generally it just annoys developers and in this case Atebits is making $ regardless of whether you pay or not (those pesky ads).
Let's just leave it as saying this is a feature we all really want (well apart from the weird luddite naysayers)...
I’m taking the purple pill
4 people think
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The UI will be just fine, @atebits is a very smart guy, and adding group functionality should not require any significant UI clutter at all.
This single piece of functionality is the only reason I cannot switch to Tweetie, and also the reason I cannot logically choose to pay for it yet. I know that I'm not alone here.
5 people think
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There's no need for APIs from Twitter in order to have groups. EventBox has a "groups-like" feature in the way of Smart Folders. You add users to Smart Folders and it simply filters existing Tweets in the timeline to only include the Tweets by those users. No API calls are made because they're already there.
This is just pure stubborness by the developer to not include the feature that virtually every Twitter user wants. Unfortunately, it wrecks an otherwise spectacular Twitter desktop app.
10 people think
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I know Atebits' stance on Groups, but I still find this a really useful feature. Nambu has it well implemented.
I’m confident
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Yes, I, too, had read Loren's blog post back in February with regards to creating multiple accounts.... but let's face it, as a clear master of UI design, he must know that this approach is far from ideal. I would rather him ask us to petition Twitter en masse for API support for groups, rather than encourage use to take up this very bizarre workaround. I hope that he is able to come up with an even better alternative. Judging by the brilliance of Tweetie for iPhone, and now for the Mac... I'm confident he'll come up with something.
I’m still a little confused, and hungry.
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I think we are all aware of the post atebits has on their blog about Groups in Twitter, however, I think must of us Twitter power user must INSIST that this is needed. Please Loren don't forsake us.
I’m frustrated
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Groups are an absolute must. I follow a lot of people, but my "best buds" group in Tweetdeck helps me hang on the every word of my favorite Twitter voices. Also great to use on release Tuesday to group all of my author buds and catch the buzz on new books.
I’m excited
3 people think
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Inappropriate?Groups are an absolute must. I follow a lot of people, but my "best buds" group in Tweetdeck helps me hang on the every word of my favorite Twitter voices. Also great to use on release Tuesday to group all of my author buds and catch the buzz on new books.
I’m excited
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I read the blog post, and I get where he's coming from. But... Other desktop apps support the feature and Tweetie's lack is problematic. I really don't want the added complexity of YATA (yet another twitter account). -
and, if you've read the blog post, you will see it says:
"Does this work? Yes, if your Twitter client is running all the time. A desktop client can get away with this because it’s constantly grabbing the freshest stuff from Twitter."
So, by his own admission, 'Method 3' would work pretty well in a desktop client. The blog post in question is talking about the iPhone client, we're asking for this feature in the desktop client. -
That said though, I do quite like their suggestion of setting up multiple twitter accounts, as with that solution my 'groups' will exist no matter which twitter client I am using.
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Inappropriate?I think we are all aware of the post atebits has on their blog about Groups in Twitter, however, I think must of us Twitter power user must INSIST that this is needed. Please Loren don't forsake us.
I’m frustrated
4 people think
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Inappropriate?Yes - I need a 'groups' feature badly. Otherwise, it's back to Tweetdeck (as much as I wish it weren't so).
Thanks...
2 people think
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Inappropriate?Yes, I, too, had read Loren's blog post back in February with regards to creating multiple accounts.... but let's face it, as a clear master of UI design, he must know that this approach is far from ideal. I would rather him ask us to petition Twitter en masse for API support for groups, rather than encourage use to take up this very bizarre workaround. I hope that he is able to come up with an even better alternative. Judging by the brilliance of Tweetie for iPhone, and now for the Mac... I'm confident he'll come up with something.
I’m still a little confused, and hungry.
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Great point. I wonder if petitioning Twitter for a feature could work. What if we had account-specific saved searches? Not just searching for a group of users but for any specific tags or other traits we like to investigate regularly. Removing the 140-character limitation on search strings would improve the situation greatly.
If Twitter enabled such info to attach to your profile, Tweetie could easily plug into that. How does this feature implementation compare to your needs and expectations? -
Inappropriate?I know Atebits' stance on Groups, but I still find this a really useful feature. Nambu has it well implemented.
I’m confident
3 people think
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Inappropriate?There's no need for APIs from Twitter in order to have groups. EventBox has a "groups-like" feature in the way of Smart Folders. You add users to Smart Folders and it simply filters existing Tweets in the timeline to only include the Tweets by those users. No API calls are made because they're already there.
This is just pure stubborness by the developer to not include the feature that virtually every Twitter user wants. Unfortunately, it wrecks an otherwise spectacular Twitter desktop app.
10 people think
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That's an interesting point- there could, in theory, be a client-side filter of tweets to divide them into separate folders/groups/stacks. That said, I've got to imagine that AteBits isn't just "stubbornly" sitting there, saying we won't give the user what they want. There must be some sort of obstruction, either that, or something like this is already in the pipeline. I just want them to implement it quickly, or at least give us a nod to let us know it's on the way.
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Inappropriate?Yeah this is a big deal. In fact a ground breaker. Right now tweetie for mac is just a better twitterffic (significantly better). Groups and saved searches are the two features of a "pro" twitter app that a lot of people can't live without.
Yes I know atebit's stance on it - but still.
I’m vaccinated
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Inappropriate?I must agree, I love the design and thought behind tweetie, but I need to be able to use groups. Jim's point about EventBox is correct, no API is being used it's simply a different view of your normal timeline.
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Well we could do that. Sure.
But let's also hope Loren takes all this on board and reconsiders any lines in the sand he may or may not have drawn. It seems to be a big deal to some people. -
The best part about lines in the sand, is that they can be erased when trampled over.
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Then it seems to me that there is a need here to put forth a formal position statement. You are either going to implement this feature or you are not. There is no middle ground here. That would enable people to make an informed decision as to whether or not to stay or not stay with this product.
You are either going to be responsive to the clear message that is being provided by your users or you are going to take a philosophic position on this point and disregard your users. In the latter case, your users will happily reciprocate. -
I don't understand why we would want or have to petition Twitter for anything. The choice to not have groups is up to the developer. The technology is there - several other apps have had it for quite some time.
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@Jim
"The technology" is not there. Hacks are there that emulate what "the technology" might look like. I agree with Loren that this needs to be properly implemented in the Twitter API first. For those of you that insist on groups, TweetDeck is still out there... -
TweetDeck, Seesmic, Twirl, EventBox and a number of other Twitter Clients have managed to add groups - despite the technology supposedly "not being there." Maybe I should have used "ability" or "capability" or some other word. The point is, Groups is possible - and it works perfectly without an official API - so there's nothing stopping Loren but himself.
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To me, it seems analogous to client-side mail filtering, which has of course been widely available for many years. In both cases, server-side filtering is much nicer, but client side filtering works adequately and is very helpful when doing on the server isn't possible.
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Inappropriate?I agree for anyone who follows even a relatively small number of people it can become impossible to keep up without any grouping or filters...
I’m anxious
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Inappropriate?It would be very helpful to have a separate area for newsbots like Fox News. Astra provides this functionality.
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Inappropriate?Please don't add groups, Tweetie works because it's simple, groups make everything far too complicated
I’m confused
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That's a dumb response. If groups are added and you don't like them - don't use them.
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You don't need to use them if you don't see the value, so why limit functionality for those of us who totally need it? They probably won't get in your way. ;-)
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Because adding groups will touch on many other parts of the UI that don't need to get more complicated. That's why I don't want them :)
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Be NICE!
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I fail to see how it makes things complicated if you simply choose not to use them.
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I'm totally being nice, just wanted to say that I really don't want this feature :)
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Inappropriate?The UI will be just fine, @atebits is a very smart guy, and adding group functionality should not require any significant UI clutter at all.
This single piece of functionality is the only reason I cannot switch to Tweetie, and also the reason I cannot logically choose to pay for it yet. I know that I'm not alone here.
5 people think
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I'm going to have to agree- I don't think I'll pay for Tweetie until there is groups integration.
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I agree. I would gladly pay for Tweetie with the groups functionality. Without it, I won't even be using the free version.
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Agree fully with this, I love the interface and usability but without groups its not particularly helpful to me, so I'll be going back to TweetDeck until its rectified.
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Inappropriate?Yes. Need groups. Impossible to work without them. TweetDeck is till a huge memory hog.
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Inappropriate?Oh heck yes on the groups.
I have a group in other twitter clients called "Work Group" and it has the folks that "tweet" that I work with. Since I am the senior helpdesk tech it makes it very easy for folks to get a hold of me (as in X Outlooks is going bananas can you swing by and look at it). and I have a SciFi group (folks that I am on staff with at a convention).
The first group is almost vital to have. though I do love tweetie though I hope that this feature gets dropped in an already great client. -
Inappropriate?As soon as this feature is added to Tweetie, I will gladly virtually plop down $20 for this application.
As for the implementation - maybe the groups could be added as tabs at the top of the window, a la Safari 4? I'm no developer so I don't know how feasible this is.
I’m anxious for this addition.
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One idea I thought of was how we have this lovely menu on the left-hand side with much blank space. I wonder if an icon could be developed for a small group—looking like the speech bubble but different somehow—and then you could create/rename/delete these group bubbles at will. To add to a group, drag that user's icon into the group bubble you wish. To remove, select that group bubble then drag the user's icon out of the window (maybe adding the *poof* animation).
Seems no less intuitive than the events add/merge/split functions in iPhoto, and it builds upon the excellent interface already built in Tweetie. Thoughts? -
Inappropriate?The "i'll pay for the app when feature X is added" is a non-starter. Generally it just annoys developers and in this case Atebits is making $ regardless of whether you pay or not (those pesky ads).
Let's just leave it as saying this is a feature we all really want (well apart from the weird luddite naysayers)...
I’m taking the purple pill
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Point taken. So how about this then: I'll USE it when group functionality is added. Right now, it doesn't support a key feature that I require for regular use.
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Oh Jon! It's like you speak from experience or something :)
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Inappropriate?Agreed. I tried the 2nd Twitter account fake group work-around. It confused the hell out of my followers, especially those with private updates, and was clunky as all get out. I reluctantly went back to hoping between Nambu and TweetDeck for the time being. In order to do without groups, I'd have to unfollow hundreds of people to get the main window down to a manageable volume.
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Yeah I am not a big fan of multiple accounts. I tried it. I didn't like it. Too many update notification bullets...
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I agree. If every twitter user had multiple accounts for each type of group they needed, it would confuse the crap out of follow-ees. Grouping should be a feature supported by Twitter via APIs, but until that point should be strapped on in heavy-weight clients.
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Inappropriate?I'd really like to see the ability to create small groups inside of Tweetie. That is realistically the only reason that I still have Tweetdeck installed. Even after only two days, the Tweetie for Mac experience is really working well for me. Thanks for doing such a great job on this and the iPhone application.
I’m excited
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Ooooh. Do you feel empowered now? Good for you!
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Inappropriate?Who ever comes up with a clever way to handle thousands of "friends" is going to have the killer Twitter app. Called 'em groups or whatever you want to call 'em but there has to be a way to split out a handfuls of users.
I love Tweetie's small footprint. You can line up many accounts on that side bar. Making TweetDeck look like a screen hog. And I love you can RT . . . er . . sorry . . . RePost from one account to another.
There certainly is room on that sidebar for some groups/user collections/posses/whatever.
I’m excited
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Inappropriate?A proposal on providing this functionality for "power users" without compromising simplicity:
- Add metadata specifiers to search, particularly "from:".
- Unlike Twitter's web search, allow "or" operations on those fields
- Place proxy icons in the left toolbar for saved searchs
Then we could build queries that include messages from friendA, friendB, &c. and save them as a "group".
There's some nuance missing here around inclusion of replies and notification of new messages, but it's a start with a quantum of utility.
I’m hopeful
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This is almost possible with 1.1 and saved searches, but the limit on search length seriously narrows "group" size. it also exposes a flaw in my plan: @replies are included.
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Just FYI. Twitter's web search does support OR operations. You just have to use a capital "OR". (e.g. from:jack OR from:jill)
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Inappropriate?That's exactly what I wanted to say! I will move to Tweetie if there was the possibility to create groups. Tweetie is most beautifull and fonctionnal app I used for tweeter, but I won't move from Tweetdeck even though I think it's an ugly application. Just because of that group feature and a lot of people I know feel exactly the same
I’m hopeful
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Inappropriate?:and a lot of people I know feel exactly the same"
What a coincidence. EVERYONE I know feels that way. Tweetie isn't even an option for a serious Twitter user. There's a reason, and it's called groups.
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Inappropriate?Having been a Twitter-groups junkie for awhile now, here are some of my thoughts...
In certain use-cases, the "multiple accounts" workaround to build follow-groups actually works quite well. An example would be for following any Twitter streams that are one-way streets (such as @woot or a webhost's status notifier). What you get when you do this workaround is a fragmentation of your Twitter identity and conversations, but this really doesn't matter when you're just passively consuming content on a one-way street. If you're following any users that fit this, then suck it up and try the multiple-account workaround. You'll find that Tweetie's UI is creepily good at handling multiple accounts, including in this use-case.
However, I completely agree that some kind of tool for grouping followees in a single account would be a very good feature. That was the only reason I used TweetDeck (which is otherwise a horrible Twitter client), and than Nambu. Depending on how you use Twitter (remember, not everyone uses it in the same way you do!), there is a need out there for splitting the firehose into smaller streams. I like staying sane as much as the next person.
It should be noted that client-side grouping doesn't scale. At all. Tweetie really is an option for a serious Twitter user, @Jim, if they're using multiple computers (and implement the separate accounts workaround), and Nambu/TweetDeck really aren't. Again, it depends how you choose to use Twitter. And I must say from experience that it absolutely sucks trying to maintain group settings across multiple instances of those apps. Now, if a client were to sync such settings between multiple instances, or if Twitter's API & core service supported groups, this wouldn't be an issue. Unfortunately, they don't. Until they do, we hack.
That said, I really would love to see @atebits implement some kind of client-side grouping tool in Tweetie until these hacks aren't necessary. I'm very excited to see the UI genius evident across this app be applied to groups, and I sincerely hope this feature is in Tweetie's future.
I’m overthinking in the brainpan.
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Inappropriate?I would love this feature. I'm not going to say I won't buy it until then though as it's a great client already (I've already paid for and bought a license). However I really, really would love a few groups in the sidebar. I've read and looked at the blogposting and understand the points about on a mobile client why it wouldn't work well - however for the desktop client, I think that this feature is now widely regarded as a necessity. -
Inappropriate?Not only this but I'd like to save searches to possibly a panel on the right side, or have it all customizable with a little bit of smart search code, and a panel/window/tab system to make the most out of twitter.
Check out my other ideas in my profile I have so many!
I’m anxious
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Inappropriate?We need a default "Tweet From" account option:
My way around the "groups" issue is as follows: I've setup a second twitter a/c that's protected and I don't tweet from, but I have followed all my regular tweeters from this account, so If I'm afraid I might have missed a convo from one of the regulars, I just open that account and skim the tweets. It's fab. .. and yes I know it's a whitelist.. it's twitter so I expect it to be open and visible.
Problem is that I forget that I'm using that second account sometime, and I end up replying to the tweets from my shadow account instead of my main account. Mostly it's fine becase they nearly all aware of my second account and have followed back, but sometime I get a "Huh? Who are you and why are you replying to @cityguyyoga's tweet"
I know there is a pull down in the reply dialog to choose who to tweet from. but sometime I forget. It's embarrassing. and since I can't delete the tweet, I have to open a browser and manually delete.
It would be FAB if you could setup a default "Tweet From" identity because I don't ever expect to tweet from the other account anyways!
For me, I could cope with the lack of groups that way. but as it stands, I still revert to tweetdeck to catchup with regulars. Please let me ditch tweetdeck for good :-)
I’m hopeful
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Inappropriate?By implementing this feature Tweetie would then allow people to "work" in a manner that is comfortable to them. Instead of forcing people to change the way they naturally work.
Although I use multiple accounts, I still have a need to group my following by importance, by type, by anything a user would need.
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Inappropriate?Pretty please add groups?
(+ saving of window states (open / position / content of compose windows) between launches)
I’m very hopeful we will see this one day
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Inappropriate?I have an idea on how to gracefully add Groups or stacks... without too much addition to the app. you can see my post here http://gsfn.us/t/9vph.
Here is an image preview with a quick explanation.
The back image shows what normal search to the twitter api (search as it is now) would look like.
The front image shows that the search is searching the cached timeline of that user. The front images also shows what the saved searches would look like to show you if the saved either api searches or timeline searchs.
I’m hopeful for this addition!
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Inappropriate?Sounds like this is now in the works from Twitter's side:
http://blog.twitter.com/2009/09/soon-...
And that Loren is aware and working on it:
http://twitter.com/atebits/status/451...
I’m happy
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