Ethical Business T&Cs

Not in the UK. See item 7.8 in your T&Cs:
http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/top...

Small businesses should be aware of this as it removes piece of mind when ordering remotely. Also the distance selling legislation is to protect people from receiving goods that might not be as expected. Hence 7 days from receipt of goods.

I'm still not sure what the problem is, 7.3 says consumers can return the product for any reason?

Firstly thanks for replying Jimmy . . . . . .

. . . . . . . but, where I am equally concerned about consumers, my current issue is with business T&Cs. (Business Users:7.8 Notwithstanding anything herein to the contrary (including without limitation Clauses 3.3 & 3.4), Business Users may only reject Product for material non-conformity with the Product Description by providing written notice to Dell within 7 days after delivery or otherwise shall be deemed to have accepted the Products. ).

Even the wording does not make it clear that this means there is strictly NO refund or return under any circumstances. Even catastrophic failure or hardware results in a like for like replacement (the warranty stranglehold).

Businesses, think before you buy with Dell! Especially when this relates to a first time, one man business, buyers who has a lot more to loose than the mighty Dell.

Do you have a specific complaint maybe I can get you some help?

Indeed I do but I doubt you will make any headway. I have had several very irate conversations with Customer Relations (an oxymoron). However I would always appreciate someone else's input., thanks for your offer.

I advised someone to buy from Dell (as I have done for many years now). They chose to buy as a small business customer, in retrospect a big mistake. As a first time buyer they bought over the phone and were at no times told of or pointed to the T&Cs. Money was taken and after this point the T&Cs were sent.

When the laptop arrived it was a lot more heavier and larger than the description had made out (accurate spec but not reflective of the concerns my colleague, female, had raised during the call). The buyer, prior to switching on (and it has still not been switched on) phoned and later emailed Dell to request returning the laptop for a lighter (and this is the bit that gets me) and more expensive model; even offering to pay the postage!. Since then all the dozens of interactions with Dell have been absolute refusals to settle this issue amicably.

Why am I mad?
a) I have personally bought or specified for companies tens of thousands of pounds worth of Dell hardware, since 1997; 80% of my office here is Dell and yet Dell would jeopardise this relationship and so many customers for a £630 laptop? !!
b) up until this discussion, the attitude has been as belligerent and unhelpful as it possible could. I am a business man, in my company we would have solved this problem weeks ago to both parties mutual satisfaction.

Do you need any further information from me?

If you could send me you the service tag or order number and contact information to customer_advocate@dell.com and put Attn: Jimmy P in the subject line I'll forward this to someone who may be able to assist you.

OK will do but I don't think the heels can be dug out, even at the expense of Dell's good name, revenues to the company or the unsavoury thought of raising awareness of the T&Cs to business folk.

If there is any resolution I promised to report back (good or bad).

Thanks

I still have not received an e-mail from you, did you send one?

Yes I sent it last week (7/25/08 4:27 PM).

As instructed entitled "Attn: Jimmy P"

i have just sent it again

I still haven't received it, I have asked the mods to forward my Dell e-mail address to you.

OK thanks Jimmy. I will forward it when I receive your direct email address.

I haven't received your email address yet. Could you jog the mods memory?

Have you been contacted by anyone yet?

Not as yet.

mjbryan, I hope you don't object to someone else jumping in here. I have a question & some observations. I'm in the States so the question has to do with Dell publications. Over here all the Dell product catalogs I've received over the years (except the mini magazines) have the weights & dimensions of portable systems listed on the page along with the picture. Is it not the same in the UK? The statement "When the laptop arrived it was a lot more heavier and larger than the description had made out (accurate spec but not reflective of the concerns my colleague, female, had raised during the call)" is rather confusing.

I too am a business man (no, the avatar is not me) & one of my businesses is being a computer tech & builder. When clients come to me for a consult on buying a laptop one of the things I make it a point to be sure they understand is how big & heavy the system is because they can become a bear to carry around after a while. Seems to me like if this had been done before the purchase in your colleague's case then this entire situation could've been avoided. So why wasn't it?

No please jump in :-) Indeed and this is why the distance selling regulations are so important. I bought a Dell laptop once with a blue facia. However when it arrived it wasn't reflective of the blue on the picture; the actual machine had a dull matt blue finish, although I probably wouldn't have returned it for this.

In the UK we are stuck somewhere between pounds and kilograms and I think most people (myself included) find it difficult to truly picture the combination of size and the weight. Again you make a good point about trying it prior to purchase. Where would you do this (my colleague is self employed and works from home)? This again is the reason for distance selling legislation and why it has been afforded to consumers. Personally I don't think it is unreasonable to offer a 7 day cooling off period. Most high street retailers offer a satisfaction guarantee. Also it is not as if my colleague was asking for their money back, indeed they intended to spend more!

Since starting this chain I have been in touch with the Federation of Small Businesses and the Office of Fair Trading. It seems I am not alone in being unhappy about businesses employing their T&Cs to get around fair practice for business buyers online (which most don't do BTW). Also there is concern about how these T&C are phrased and when and how they are presented to the buyer. From the responses I have seen, I believe it won't be long before this is outlawed here in Europe.

Hi Jimmy, still no word from Dell, have you heard anything?

No, I'll e-mail them again.

Thanks Jimmy. Nothing this end still.

I am getting replies from the Small Business Federation and Consumer Focus. I am pleased to say, where Dell customer relations don't seem to be concerned by this practice, it is heartening to see that they are very concerned by this.

But thanks for you efforts so far.

They told me they have already talked to you before I e-mailed them and they would not accept a return. Wish I could of been more help.

Yes I did say I had been in contact with Dell ("Since then all the dozens of interactions with Dell have been absolute refusals to settle this issue amicably."). Customer Relations need some induction level training (you don't have to look far on the web to see something is badly out of sync in the factory!).

This could have been solved so easily and to the advantage of both parties. It is a tiny issue that will become a monster. So now the worst of all outcomes
- Dell's T&Cs, and utter disregard for loyal customers, will be broadly exposed.

However thanks for your help - it is the only civil response I have had to date.

I will report back . . . . . . . . .

Well, it seems that its not just the business T&Cs that Dell have taken a guileful approach to. In July 2006 the OFT (Office of Fair Trading) requested Dell change their T&Cs to become more fair to consumers on four key points. (http://www.oft.gov.uk/news/press/2006...). Again a questionable approach to the distance selling regulations.

What a company!

You see Dell don't like their customers:
http://uk.reuters.com/article/technol...

I really don't think Dell like their customers:
http://uk.reuters.com/article/technol...

"PC-maker Dell's profits slump 63%" Not a surprise. Since making my first compaint, c.11 months ago, I moved from being a loyal Dell buyer to buying (and advising others) to purchase from other manufactures. Aprox £6.5K of goods that might have had a Dell badge on.

Thank you Dell. You have helped me discovered more stylish, better quality and cheaper hardware from other vendors and all because we wanted to return a product and buy a more expensive model!! You deserve everything that comes to you.

As Dell profits continue to fall I thought I would let you know I have just bought my second non-Dell laptop since this interaction. A very beautiful and well behaved Samsung.