Loading Profile...
Seeking repeal for the 50% penalty.
3
people have this problem
I have this problem, too!
Tell me when someone solves it.
The more people who report this problem, the more it gets noticed.
The more people who report this problem, the more it gets noticed.
The best solutions from the company
-
For the record, I think this is conclusively settled.
Satyaki, I'll be in touch regarding closure of two of your three accounts. I'm sure you are aware that if we detect any further gaming from your remaining account then it will be closed also.
However, to be honest, you got on to the leaderboard without gaming so I don't think you will have any problems making the $30k back by fair means.
The company says
this solves the problem
-
There has only been one instance so far of a user being fined for gaming the system. This was on the account 'satyaki'.
Over the past week the system identified that accounts 'satyaki', 'satyaki_d' and 'tuts' were behaving in a way that suggested they had a single user and that they were extensively trying to game the system. For example the user 'tuts' has created 13 questions, all at highly inaccurate 5% or 95% (you can see that here: http://www.hubdub.com/e/User/_4781). In every one of those questions the user 'satyaki' had very large positions which would have netted a very large windfall had they not been voided.
All three accounts were informed on the 2/13/08 that he was on the watch list. Then satyaki was informed on the 2/15/08 that he had a final warning. However despite that there was further gaming including this question which was created yesterday at 11:25 PST:
http://www.hubdub.com/e/Market/Will_t...
On this market satyaki had H$6,500, tuts had H$18,000 and satyaki_d had H$2,900.
I really don't like having to fine users. Apart from this instance the very few number of users that we have warned have complied with our requests not to continue gaming the system. Satyaki and his alter-egos chose to ignore that. My view is if there is further gaming between these accounts then all three accounts will be shut down.
As ever I would like input from the rest of the Hubub community: Is this fair?
The company and 1 other person say
this solves the problem
Create a customer community for your own organization
Plans starting at $19/month
-
Inappropriate?the account name is satyaki and i am 17 on the leaderboard.can i get some attention here?? -
Inappropriate?OK, it will take some time to lay out the full extent of the gaming. I will publish this tomorrow.
As I noted in the email, to appeal the decision you accept that we will have to publish the full set of evidence here (including connected accounts, gaming questions etc). By appealling here I assume you accept that condition. Let me know by tomorrow if that is not the case. -
Inappropriate?The evidence must be related to gaming activity which you have accused me of after the second mail dated 16/2/08.
-
Inappropriate?Why does infernalmachine have this problem too? Was his money reset too?What happened to satyaki. Awaiting information -
Inappropriate?I don't have this problem. I'd appreciate it if you would be more careful with your insinuations.
I won an amount of money on a question on which I bet very heavily. Later someone who lost on that question convinced an editor to retroactively void the question. This is something I have disputed. Anyway, the money I made is included in my net worth but not in the quarterly gain, just as it would be for anyone else in my situation.
I just realized that because I clicked the button up top in order to follow this topic, it announces that I have this problem too. I don't. -
Inappropriate?"I'd appreciate it if you would be more careful with your insinuations"
-If you noticed, it says on the question "infernalmachine has this problem too". How much more careful do you want me to be?
I’m amused
-
Inappropriate?There has only been one instance so far of a user being fined for gaming the system. This was on the account 'satyaki'.
Over the past week the system identified that accounts 'satyaki', 'satyaki_d' and 'tuts' were behaving in a way that suggested they had a single user and that they were extensively trying to game the system. For example the user 'tuts' has created 13 questions, all at highly inaccurate 5% or 95% (you can see that here: http://www.hubdub.com/e/User/_4781). In every one of those questions the user 'satyaki' had very large positions which would have netted a very large windfall had they not been voided.
All three accounts were informed on the 2/13/08 that he was on the watch list. Then satyaki was informed on the 2/15/08 that he had a final warning. However despite that there was further gaming including this question which was created yesterday at 11:25 PST:
http://www.hubdub.com/e/Market/Will_t...
On this market satyaki had H$6,500, tuts had H$18,000 and satyaki_d had H$2,900.
I really don't like having to fine users. Apart from this instance the very few number of users that we have warned have complied with our requests not to continue gaming the system. Satyaki and his alter-egos chose to ignore that. My view is if there is further gaming between these accounts then all three accounts will be shut down.
As ever I would like input from the rest of the Hubub community: Is this fair?
The company and 1 other person say
this solves the problem
-
Inappropriate?Fair. Very fair.
-
Inappropriate?I'm not surprised that someone appeared who tried to cheat that way. But what really surprises me is his boldness and impudence he showed here.
The penalty was surely deserved, for his ignorance I'd punish him even a bit more. Perhaps take him another 20%, freeze his account for some days and in case he remains stubborn afterwards delete him. Usual procedure for such freaks. -
Inappropriate?Sorry if there is confusion about "having this problem too". We're always refining the language that helps people follow topics, so I'll share this with our group. I hope that our language experimentation doesn't lead to even more heated language between users of Hubdub and Get Satisfaction.
I’m hoping we all do get along
-
Inappropriate?Considering that hubdub is all about opinions, I'd say that the community is surprisingly peaceful. Perhaps because the comments function isn't really felicitous yet ;)
I’m expecting fearsome debates in the future
1 person says
this solves the problem
-
Inappropriate?Any chance to have a "follow this topic" button, separate from the "I have this problem" one?
-
Inappropriate?Ok look here , the question that has been put up here had been through the normal 12 hour ban on bets for me. if someone else fails to bet on it or if it isn't voided in 12 hours it is a lapse on your side and it isnt my fault and niether it is my fault if hubdub gives me the go ahead with the question after 12 hours.so it is only fair that i start pourin money into it after 12 hours , now you cant blame me for that . for that matter i propose that you remove the 5 -95 option to prevent people from using it .so where does this question of gaming arise.
ps: you were supposed to furnish me with details of my last gaming transaction which i am sure was before the day on which i recieved my warning. -
Inappropriate?Perhaps. This is something we've debated at length. In fact, this interface previously said "follow this topic". We changed it and added "You're following this topic" language to try and keep that understanding there. So, when you "have the problem" you are following it. But -- evident from your suggestion -- that is not as apparent *before* you start following something. Thank you! Great feedback.
I’m glad you asked
-
Inappropriate?besides i think you forgot to mention it nigel but i was patiently waiting for 12 hours on all three accounts before placing the bets..besides i wasn't too sure of the question either but i was willing to take a risk(risk of betting not gaming) considering the fact that if i won i would be back at my position.
One more thing , i don't see the harm in maintaining 3 accounts as long as i am not creating question off one and betting immediately betting with the other.you will notice that i have not displayed any such behaviour as mentioned above after receiving that last mail and so i think i deserve a refund.
ps:maybe it slipped your mind but all the money on that question wasn't mine ,i placed $29000 and the total was $52000 . -
Inappropriate?"... if someone else fails to bet on it or if it isn't voided in 12 hours it is a lapse on your side and it isnt my fault ... "
I think that may be an assumption. I know of nothing that states a question that is in existence for more than 12 hours can't be voided for any reason.
For example, here is a question that is more than a day old, with HD 30,000 on it, and less than an hour to suspension, that has NOT yet been voided.
<http://www.hubdub.com/e/Market/Will_L...>
I predict it will be voided. -
Inappropriate?Lol, that is simply insane.
Nooo, of course it's normal that multiaccounts are welcome, isn't it that way in any game ?
And of course HD has to prevent 95-5 questions technically, while they might be needed elsewhere ( as they are realistic values at some questions ), just so that dudes like sd can't abuse those odds.
Well after your responses I agree that you might lack the willingness to use odds in a logical way, so let's think together how we can protect HD from your questions ... hey, I have a great idea there. You too ?
Well let's give it a last try first ...
Read the rules and the guide how to create good questions. They say for example:
1.1
"Has reasonable starting likelihoods: when you create a question you choose the starting likelihoods of the outcomes too. It’s hard to decide these exactly, but likelihoods that are clearly out (e.g. Will Elvis return in 2008? 50%) can cause a question to be voided."
I mention that just in case that you repeat your dumb attitude given here:
"if someone else fails to bet on it or if it isn't voided in 12 hours it is a lapse on your side and it isnt my fault and niether it is my fault if hubdub gives me the go ahead with the question after 12 hours.so it is only fair that i start pourin money into it after 12 hours"
Neither do we have to scan all created cheating questions 24h/day just to stay on the same level as the cheater who created them, nor does the HD staff need the extra burden to find and void your questions.
If that is beyond your possibilities just leave. Sayonara ! -
Inappropriate?Hmmm ... is that why you created a question:
<http://www.hubdub.com/e/Market/Will_H...>
If everyone with a question/dispute created a market question, the board would rapidly go down hill.
@ Nigel Eccles -- I think you (Hubdub) have been wayyyy more than fair on this situation. -
Inappropriate?Gee ... the question, referenced above, was voided ... with H$70,000 on it.
This was voided after predictions were closed.
No surprise there. -
Inappropriate?you people don't get my point...hubdub prevents users from betting on their own questions so that they CANNOT game the system.Now i have followed these rules with all my accounts and i have restrained from betting for 12 hours , so how am i cheating. I had left the question there for all the users for 12 hours such that people like you could make a decision but if you choose to ignore it then it is definitely not my fault.
Sorry to repeat this but golwar please read this-
"...i wasn't too sure of the question either but i was willing to take a risk(risk of betting not gaming) considering the fact that if i won i would be back at my position..."
The odds were perfectly alright , you have no clue on what goes on on the show so why are you raising that point.
Besides this debate was meant to censure the acts of alleged gaming for which i lost half my fortune so why doesn't hubdub come out with those? -
Inappropriate?this debate is taking too long ..i want it to be settled fast so guys could you tell me a time when you are online so that i can try to be there at that time too.My time zone is 5and a half hours ahead of gmt so i am online from 6:30 pm GMT to about 9:00pm GMT. I also come online at around 6:30 am GMT and 10:20 am GMT when all of you are probably sleepin(...zzzz!!)
-
-
Inappropriate?I'm awake. I'm waiting for the Hawaii results in the Dem brawl.
Here's my response to
"...if someone else fails to bet on it or if it isn't voided in 12 hours it is a lapse on your side and it isnt my fault..."
When I see a question with outrageous odds that I know is a gaming attempt and that will probably be voided, I avoid placing any wagers on this type of question. Two reasons: Why waste my money by letting it get tied up in a question that will just be voided, and why risk giving HD admins the impression that I'm in on the gaming?
I imagine that most users agree, thus the low activity on your gamed questions.
Plus, we all know that HD admins don't review each new question, and that they sometimes don't settle questions immediately after the settlement date due to time zone differences. Your plea is confirming that you have taken advantage of both of these facts.
I think HD's decision is fair. Thanks for catching this, Nigel!
I’m thinking SD is the "blame the victim" type....
-
Inappropriate?Everyone's opinion on this debate, according to me, is biased(both of those for and against). Think of it this way as the sequence of events, and then post your opinions:
1.sd gamed the system initially.
2.He went to the top few of the leaderboard.
3.He got an email warning him against gaming.
4. He created a question again, with good odds(according to him), but it was voided, apparently because the HD admins knew nothing about the show.
5.This was taken to be gaming, and he was penalised.
Therefore, the penalty was fair, but only in light of the evidence given here. If new evidence is provided by sd to prove that he abided by the warning, or by HD to prove he did not abide by the warning, then that will settle the debate. -
Inappropriate?If you check created questions for the three accounts that Satyaki now admits are his you will see that he has been creating questions at deliberately inaccurate odds for about a week including on Saturday and Monday after the final warning. These accounts are:
http://www.hubdub.com/p/UserViewbydat...
http://www.hubdub.com/p/UserViewbydat...
http://www.hubdub.com/p/UserViewbydat...
As 99.9% of the Hubdub community understands the challenge here is in making predictions about uncertain events, not seeing how many gaming questions Hubdub admin can catch. -
Inappropriate?For the record, I think this is conclusively settled.
Satyaki, I'll be in touch regarding closure of two of your three accounts. I'm sure you are aware that if we detect any further gaming from your remaining account then it will be closed also.
However, to be honest, you got on to the leaderboard without gaming so I don't think you will have any problems making the $30k back by fair means.
The company says
this solves the problem
-
Inappropriate?I have to agree with Nigel, I feel this is closed, but sd seems to be the person who doesn't use logic very often. If you create a question with largely incorrect odds, then (even _after_ 12 hours!!!) bet on it, it can and probably will be voided.
Secondly, Nigel, I think he should be banned, he is obviously ignorant and displays no use of logic.
I’m unhappy I had to say this, but someone had to say it!
EMPLOYEE
EMPLOYEE
EMPLOYEE
