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I’m frustrated

Talk me into keeping the Force

In need of some moral support with this thing. Like everyone else here I was beyond excited to get the Force after its announcement in Jan. But, at this point, issue after issue after issue, I’m just not convinced.
I tried reaching out to Akai in hopes I would at LEAST get a line on when we could expect a much needed firmware update, but, all I got was crickets, no reply. nada.
Is this common with new products from Akai? I had an MPC Live and loved it, but I got it almost a year after release. Any words of encouragement would greatly be appreciated,
J
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  • At this point, I feel your pain, mine is almost going back in the box, back to the retailer, I have spent so many hours trying to get the Force to do what I know it could and should be capable of, but it really isn't the all in one solution it was made out to be. It's a sketch pad, nothing more.
    • So was the case when I purchased The Push, Renaissance and And Machine Studio Ive had them sitting in a bass case depreciateing in value. Ready to sell practicly an intire studio for Two of these because I belived in the concept and inivisioned the sky beeing the limit. If only i had 3 push and An MPC Live yet now we have the Force Beautiful machine great idea but after one day of use Ive been in disbelief. I can imagine and or for see solutions and work arounds that appear to point to Abelton live yet that would make The force a decated controler for Abelton, sad to say I struggle with a possible sale yesterday, knowing what i know now. It almost feels like Milli Vanilli! Sorry Guys
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  • Don’t get me wrong, I REALLY want to keep it. I got rid of the mpc live for it thinking it would be as described.

    Sad
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  • 2
    Hey, I want to keep mine too, but I really wanted a single box that I could produce, compose, record, DJ with and it would be more than a glorified sketch pad, which is what this is. It has that possibility with the hardware as is, but it really needs midi import, Ableton export, disk streaming of samples, the ability to insert tracks in between tracks, be able to save samples as mp3, to chose not to convert mp3 to wav automatically, non-destructive sample/song editing, different time signature choices, automation lanes and sample hold for switching projects.
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    • Final note on this one, Adam, your condescending comments are better served aimed at someone who doesn't know what you are talking about. Don't talk down to me, you don't know me or what I am about. Yes, I know the numbers, WAV and AIFF are lossless, and are 1411 kbps encoding, and don't really need a decoder in the true sense, as the are not compressed. MP3 files are at highest CBR 320 kbps encoding, and don't sound quite as good for some people. However, the file weight is much lighter, and to read the file, you actually need a decoder (codec) to read the file. Also, I bet that about 50 percent of people have about half a chance of identifying the audible difference between a properly compressed 320 mp3 vs a 1411 WAV or AIFF file. So great, you don't book people who use mp3s, good for you. Almost everyone else I know does.
    • This comment was removed on 2019-05-28.
      see the change log
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  • 1
    I remember when I received my Akai MPC Live with 2.0 firmware...that was almost a year ago. I remember the frustration when things went wrong. Today we have 2019, 2.4 update is onboard. Using MPC Live for ~4 hours a day and haven't face any issues so far. It was worth to wait, wait also guys. Akai is probably polishing that diamond right now.

    @max

    Regarding your wish list mate, with all respect - we get things we request from Akai though, last 3 updates prove that. Things you have request are all-ready mentioned in many idea requests so this is a matter of time (and give 'em a bit more time so they will make it properly).

    Be also aware that many times problem is with user. I thought many times that my MPC is crappy until experienced friend showed me that i was just using it wrong way. Knowledge is the mother of all solutions. Do not put a cross on Force, me and my friend is testing it at the moment so if you could specify what exactly is your problem maybe we will sort it out together.

    Cheers to all you audiophiles :)
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  • @Jakub, I understand that some times there is a PIBMAC issue, but I am really trying very hard to educate myself about the unit, by many hours in front of it, and reading the documentation and looking at videos. However, the strange upconverting mp3, no sample hold while switching projects and lack of disk streaming will make this basically non-usuable as a all-in-one device for a live set of any length that's not super repetitive. If there was some sort of official assurance that they intend to address these issues in the future, that would be great. My main issue is that if I only 4-5 mp3 tracks to a project, I get a low memory error. I know that most people are going to use this mainly as a composition tool, but I had hopes for it to be a hybrid device, one thing that I could bring to my sets and do close to everything with.
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  • Be patient my friend because hard drive streaming is coming back ;)
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  • @max for you:
    MPC - Submit a Feature Request http://97.107.134.128/feedback/create...

    MPC - Submit a Bug Report
    http://97.107.134.128/feedback/create...

    Here are your links, but be sure I've already submitted this feature.

    Regarding when we can expect our issues sorted out? No one knows, we can cut this discussion here, as programmer I know the best that we can't speculate. Be lenient, i know it is not something you want to hear but I give you an example that before MPC software 2.4 the FX on MPC Live were really crappy, so bad it would be better without them and yeah I had to use it without it (didn't like connecting to PC), now those FX from AIR are a game changer, was worth it.
    We have to admit that there isn't gear like Force on the market. It is obvious that 10-20% of soft will be buggy. Take your time exploring other areas. When you look at time frames between updates starting up from 2.0 especially we MUST admit they Akai's development team is catching nice tempo. And still 2GB is quiet efficient to play with it. limit amount of samples/clips. Before you even pull any samples there pull them via Steinberg WaveLab or iZotope plugins and cut it a bit, very often we can lower sample rate and etc to make them lightweight, we can reduce it to proper size without loosing quality. If you will bother me later afternoon then i will find you some guides how to do that on my hard drives. I don't want to give any numbers here but this way i lower file size for about 30-40% possibly. Errors displayed can be cause by totally different root cause. There can be enough memory but linux\unix system is pre-reserving memory "to be allocated".

    Today I will load 16 pad matrix with clips, load them with AIR FX and blow those two synth plugins running and i will test if really it is not managable to play anything

    P.S

    The record holder in the category of "best hearing" also belongs to the row of butterflies. This is a larger barcelacle (Galleria mellonella) that senses ultrasound at 300 kHz. For comparison - a man hears sounds with a maximum frequency of 20 kHz, while dolphins and bats, widely regarded as ultrasonic experts, recognize sounds up to 160 kHz.

    from me: don't look for quality in numbers and stats which you don't hear :)
    • @Jacobeen: how did the 16 pad matrix with clips work? I am saying that if I take four 7 minute songs, load them to a project, I end up with a low memory error. As for the size, these are mp3 files that get blown up to wav automatically when you load them. I would assume that since the Force uses the file, it upconverts, it probably does the same with bit reduced wavs.
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  • 1
    @jakub What do you mean "disk streaming is coming back"? My understanding is that no Akai standalone equipment has disk streaming currently. Am I incorrect?
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  • I had wondered the same thing about that statement... MPC Live doesn’t-
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  • It would be nice if there was a bit rate reduction option when importing samples
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  • Hey everybody,

    Thanks for posting!

    There are tons of plans for the Force in the works. This is the first product of its kind by Akai and I am looking forward to seeing how it grows. As mentioned, the MPC X and MPC Live are very different hardware now compared to when they were first released. Force is taking that base OS and building upon it. As it stands right now, the Force is capable of doing quite a bit. In time, its functionality and feature set will only expand on what it can already do.
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    • Indeed, especially when you have 4 and thought it came with it. Good thing my X does. More money in buying the sample pack that includes it with like 10 packs for $150 with the 50 percent off code.
    • You have four Forces? Lol I can see the future man I can I realy can
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  • But disk streaming is announced from one employee in another thread.
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  • 1
    Hi Jeff,

    just wanted to say that today, even thought i found out the Force's Warp option is crap...i STILL produced an amazing song today.
    I made a big tech house project with 12 tracks, around 80 different clips with automation and mastering.
    Everything was with chopped up loops and plugins, no audio tracks except one fx thing. It felt really good coming from a DAW on PC.

    I have this machine for less then a week, can you imagine what i can do in a month?

    Its always like this with new hardware...the beginning always sucks, specially after coming from something that works really well for you.
    Compare it with switching from Logic to Ableton, or Roland MC-505 to Cubase.

    Just keep on making music, and rely on the fact that this stuff just takes time.

    But if you dont have time, you can always return it!
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  • 1
    I just picked up the Force yesterday. Though I'm sure I'll come to have my own gripes and complaints about the Force (it wouldn't be a piece of gear if it didn't trigger new and exciting waves of frustration), at the moment I'm strangely content or even...what's the word...'happy' I believe it is.

    Before you roll your eyes, know that two day before I finally sold my Pioneer DJS-1000 and used the cash to immediately upgrade (my life). Looking forward to the future (the good and the complaining).
    matt
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    I feel ya- I was, dare I say, “in love” lol with it for the first week or so - and to be honest the only real issues Ive had were kinda minor. It’s funny though- I started this thread out of frustration with things that weren’t really important to my workflow lol . It was that Akai to that date, and actually to THIS date had/have yet to reply to my emails that were sent in the second week of February! i can’t wait for the updates!
    ps: Akai, read your emails!!!!!! There are more than a few post on here that mention ignored attempts to contact customer support. Not a good way to build customer trust
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  • I totally forgot that the main reason I replied to your post was that I've written more than a few posts on other forums titled "Talk Mr into keeping the DJS-1000". My only actual issue I've had so far was not with the Force but with registering it on the Akai website. Maybe your support requests aren't getting to anyone. Did you register your Force on their site? I figure if you can't DL a pdf with out signing your rights away, you probably can't get support until you're in the 'system'.
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  • Yes, Force is registered.
    Actually, my email was a reply to the Akai rep - my sales person at Guitar Center had them contact me- they sent an email including a service number or whatever the F they call it. I replied with the details, and, that was the last I hear from em. Nada. Crickets...
    J
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  • When you feel sad thinking at missing Force features... just think one second ad Elektron users waiting 2 years for Overbridge 2
    :)
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  • 3
    **Bug City** is what the Force is FULL of bugs, bugs, bugs. Does Akai have a QA depot? I should have read this last Saturday, the day after I got my Force delivered to me. I spent all day Saturday hitting every stupid, easy to find, non-complex, completely blocking and most importantly CREATIVELY KILLING my songwriting experience - bug there is. Sure I can use a number of other devices/SW that I have but that's NOT the point. I spent $1500 on something that was going to be a new level.. UP, not DOWN.. not hrs invested in finding clever ways around bugs that any (or ALL) musicians would hit on a constant basis. What is going on here with, at every tune, a bug here and a bug there? Some of these bugs there IS NO workaround, like the Low Memory bug. That has rendered my Force useless in multiple projects already and I've only had this for a week. You've GOT to be kidding me? The Force is about one more bad day of bugs away from shipped back to Sweetwater! PLEASE let me know there is some support and/or help here? -Cheers!
    -E
    • Im with you man I feel they released this thing way too early with the amount of issues real users have run into thus far. It's been extremely hard to get through making a regular track using normal functionality without running into some sort of MIDI note/low memory/audio clip volume/sync timing/project saving issue. I literally had a project crash on me this week when I pressed save, it totally froze up in the middle of saving and I lost all my hours of work up to that point :-/

      I've been practicing my patience more than ever using the Force and despite all the issues, i'm still actually able to produce really great music using the Force. Not without some struggles, but I am confident its only going to improve from here on out. Akai was great with fixing bugs and adding better features so far throughout the MPC Live/X product cycle, I just have to keep my patience that they will deliver.

      Also important to note the 3.0.2 update that came out a couple days ago has fixed a bunch of bugs for me, even some that were not mentioned on the update release notes page.

      I think I speak for thousands of customers worldwide in that we are all anxiously awaiting disc streaming to vastly increase the amount of audio we can have in a project.
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  • Sounds like only “lazy” or “too patriots” did not return their Forces back. I am not sure which one am I, prolly both plus “naive believer” that soon I can play in song mode, export a track, import midi, play midi over usb, send midi to external synth and pick sound back to Force. I am somehow 100% sure first adopters (== crowd funding participants contributed huge $1,500 donation) will get Akai soft free to just make thier own “pack” to upload to the device. So many basic features are missing.

    I am afraid Akai will be flooded back with returned units, thinking “people not liking it”, so people who keep it just wasted huge amount in a scale what you can get in music instruments. We all lose due to wrong promo/sales tactics, not fault for a great concept behind Force.

    Akai employees, I think it’s not the case to say “I am not leaking info” before official release. It’s more like saving the product from dead before it lifted of. Better to have honest, solid plan/roadmap when issues and basic nessesities will be addressed. Simply “not supported” is not the answer. Sum of missing obvious features does not match to the advertised Standalone product.
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  • Irony indeed... going back a few dozen replies, we were talking about how cool it would be to have frequent, smaller updates and fixes. I also fly Rc aircraft- I have several DJI drones, and guess what I have a new update waiting almost EVERY time I fly- seriously, almost every time. I fly nearly every day. And guess what else? DJI sells a fuck of a lot more drones than AKai does buggy ass music equipment.
    AKAI, you know you could release upstate and fixes more often, and as they are available. But, you don’t. Makes me start to wonder if your staff even knows how- seriously. Reminds me of a line from CASINO:
    “Either he’s in on it, or he’s too stupid to know better”
    Done
    J
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