Alto TS215 red LED flashing at lower than expected volume.

I have the Alto ZMX862 mixer & the Alto TS215 loud-speakers. Im running an acoustic guitar, female vocals and a pedal that produces drums and a bass line into it. Im setting the gain as best I know how on the mixer. I'm setting the volume to 12 o'clock as recommended n the speakers, at the peak of "line level" and the beginning of "mic level"

I am disappointed that this set up sounds no louder than my old PA which was a pair of passive 300 watt (continuous) powered by a 300w per channel powered mixer! When I push my Alto set up as loud as I need for some larger pubs the red light flashes on/off especially on louder vocals and is no louder than my old "inferior" P.A.

How can 300w sound the same level as 550w (continuous) ?

Id also like to know, using my new Alto set up, can I take the speaker level past 12 o'clock and venture a little into "mic" volume" say at 1-2 o'clock position to give me a little more "head-room"?

Thanks for any advice.
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  • Hello again Marc.

    Hmmmnnn... I have to say that I've noticed this too. I do question the rating of theses cabs. They're supposed to be 550W RMS but I'm not convinced. As per my answer to your other question re: the subs. on these forums: I've never heard such wonderful sound (and I really do mean that). But It's not 550W RMS x 2 (plus the subs.). I have two Marshall Code 50 amps. that are micd. up to play through the Alto system (stereo). But I can tell you that it's not even necessary to mic. them up i.e. the Marshall's will cut through on their own. And I know that somebody is bound to take me to task and say that it's not a fair comparison. I disagree, These are modelling amps. not 100W valve heads with 4 x 12 cabs.!!! And not to mention the fact that "on a good night" I have been known to put my face right up to the cabs.!!! LOL!!! Amazing sound!!! But 550W RMS per channel??? Nah.

    The other issue that I've noted is that Alto recommends to never run these things at 12 'o clock and this has upset more than a few people here. I also have to admit that because I love these darn things so much I "baby" them i.e. I'm paranoid about those clipping LEDs!!! LOL!!! Point is: there are many posts on these forums where the tweeters have packed up (and in some cases entire cabs.) because they've been overdriven in some cases while in other cases they've not been overdriven at all (run at nothing more than 11 'o clock). Oddly enough though: I did have a lengthy discussion with the importers here (not the dealer) and they assured me that they demo these things with everything on 12 'o clock and have been doing so for a long time and they've never had a problem (and I know that this stuff does get rather pushed and abused at their premises). In spite of this though: I don't run mine at anything over 11 'o clock. Alright: truth be told I have tried running them at 12 'o clock with no issues whatsoever and no clipping LED's at all (well: only in the dark can you see them faintly coming on and off) but given all of the posts on these forums I'm too nervous to run them continually like that (from what I gather they're just a tad to "sensitive" for want of a better word). To be honest: I doubt that Alto (or anybody else) is going to sanction your pushing them beyond the 12 'o clock position. And frankly: I cannot figure why Alto did it this way i.e. there should have been a line in and mic. in (or do away with the mic. in totally as a mixer is a "must have" and really not an optional item). On the other hand and for what it's worth: I know a (qualified) sound engineer who uses the 210 system (with a sub.) and in medium size venues he's been asked to turn it down!!! Oh and this I believe is important: the sub. makes a WORLD of difference!!! Technically the power output of the cabs. is not going to have increased by connecting a sub. but perceptually it makes a WORLD of difference.

    You are obviously experienced in these matters so who am I to question but do you think it could have to do with your mix (the clipping I mean)??? My setup: all MIDI tracks (keyboards, bass, drums) (SampleTank samples) as well as guitar (as detailed above) going through the system and no clipping LED's. This being said though: no vocals as yet (all applications from vocalists that have Ronnie James Dio's power and range are most welcome!!! LOL!!!) and maybe therein lies the difference and maybe I'm in for a shock myself one of these fine days (but then again: I do play a lot of live concert CD's through the system and no clipping either). Best way (only way that works for me anyway) is to solo each track on the mixer to set the individual levels and then from there I can move the total mix up. When it gets to max. on the mixer then that's it i.e. "as good (as loud) as it gets" (and no clipping). I don't use any effects or EQ on the mixer either other than some compression for the micd. up amps. I do, however, use compression on the MIDI (sampled) tracks and a limiter on the master output. Mixing desk is a Behringer QX1622 (unfortunately the Alto mixer that I bought had an issue with USB recording i.e. background noise so I had to return it because there was no known solution).

    Anyway. Hope that above throws SOME light on the various issues anyway.

    Regards,

    Dale.
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  • Thx for the reply Dale.

    Following on, if using a mixer > subwoofer > speaker set up. is it possible to turn back the bass on the speakers but leave the bass level coming from the woofer untouched?

    eg. if I dial back some bass on the mixer to take it a little more easy on the speakers will that effect the bass coming from the woofer too as thats also connected to the mixer? Or is there a way round that?

    Many thanks!
    Marc
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  • Hi Marc.

    My pleasure.

    Only way I could think to do that is if you have two main outs (or one main out and a sub. mix out) on your mixer i.e. one mix to the speakers and the other mix to the sub. That way you'd be independently controlling the speakers and the sub. The sub. itself doesn't have a "tone" control if that's what you're asking. This being said: believe me when I say that these subs. have got bass "in spades". What I'm saying is that by dialing back on the bass being sent out to the system as a whole (if not hooked up separately as per my suggestion) you'd in all probability be fine anyway (and you could always turn the sub. up a bit assuming you're not already running them on max. i.e. 12 'o clock). Otherwise: get two subs. and hook them up like mine.

    Regards,

    Dale.

    P.S.

    Just curious. I was reading the manual i.e. concerned as to why your setup is indicating clipping (or "Signal/Limit" as Alto calls it). Are your lights flashing now and then or are they coming on and remaining steady??? The manual specifically says "if the LED is in red continuously, reduce the volume of your input source". From what I gather the odd flash now and then should be acceptable (although I personally would not take the chance). I think 'ol "Bill R." needs to step in here i.e. I don't want you going an blowing things up based on my input!!!

    P.P.S

    You could always "go for broke" like that Italian chap on the other thread that I've just added my two cents worth to i.e. 2 x TS218 subs. and 4 x TS215 speakers!!! I'll bet that sounds (even more) "monster"!!! LOL!!!
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