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DL2 and DL3 not working on Mavericks 10.9 ?

Does either version of Delicious Library freeze, act glitchy, crash or have any other issues? 
We reported some strange behavior to Apple and they said they have two known graphics driver bugs in Mavericks. One will definitely be fixed in the next update, the other is being investigated.
It would be incredibly helpful if you could please let us know exactly what's happening and the Make, Model and Year of your computer so we can report this information to Apple.

Thanks for your help!
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  • I’m optimistic...
    Hi Allison,

    Upon loading my Library, DL 2.8.1 is crashing my entire system. It's so bad that I can't even force quit. I actually have to manually power down the entire iMac. If I trash the .plist files, I can get it to launch for a second, but then it immediately freezes after displaying a static image of my content.

    Model Identifier: iMac13,2
    Processor Name: Intel Core i7
    Processor Speed: 3.4 GHz
    Total Number of Cores: 4
    Memory: 16 GB
    Chipset Model: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 680MX
    VRAM (Total): 2048 MB

    I appreciate you pursuing this with Apple, and I hope to enjoy continued support for DL 2.
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  • Hi. Since Mavericks each time I lunch DL2, my entire system is crashing. Only way to use it again, shut down it by press the power button.
    Actually the exact same problem as Bijatron.

    MacBook Pro Retina 2012

    2,3 Ghz i7
    8 Go 1600 Mhz DDR3

    Thanks.
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  • Same problem here:
    Model Name: iMac
    Model Identifier: iMac13,2
    Processor Name: Intel Core i7
    Processor Speed: 3.4 GHz
    Chipset Model: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 675MX
    VRAM (Total): 1024 MB
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  • Hey Gang, As I have Posted in other Threads here... DL has said that its a Appl Graphics issue and they are waiting for the tools from apple to fix this issue for I assume both DL2 & DL3

    So I await with everyone else, but I haven't upgraded to Maverick until this issue is solved. I am still using DL2 because it works with my iPhone App.
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  • Same problem here with DL2 and Mavericks. App launches but just displays an empty shelf and then locks up whole machine.

    MacBook Pro Retina 2012
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  • I’m P.O.ed
    In my case, after upgrading 10.8.5 to 10.9 DL hangs trying to find iTunes album art (it never asked for it when on 10.8 (Mountain Lion). My DL3 database is unusable in that DL3 does not get past the hanging.
    Hardware Overview:

    Model Name: Mac mini
    Model Identifier: Macmini5,2
    Processor Name: Intel Core i7
    Processor Speed: 2.7 GHz
    Number of Processors: 1
    Total Number of Cores: 2
    L2 Cache (per Core): 256 KB
    L3 Cache: 4 MB
    Memory: 8 GB
    Boot ROM Version: MM51.0077.B10
    SMC Version (system): 1.75f0

    I'm going to be a REAL UNHAPPY camper if I have to rebuild my whole DL3 DB; it took me over ten hours to build it last time and that was with the iPhone scanner app! What is so extremely maddening is that as soon as DL3 starts up, it jumps to asking for there whereabouts of iTunes and then hangs FOREVER; I have to FORCE stop it (cmd-opt-esc) to terminate the hang (and yes, I've waited quite a while; up to 20 minutes so far)!

    Hope the DL3 devs are reading this ...

    Collecting More info: here are filtered DL3 entries from the Console Log:

    I put the Mac OS X Console output in DropBox so it's more readable and doesn't create so much output for others to page down on:

    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4...

    Here's a Log Leach log output which may be more readable: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/4...

    BTW DL staff: what more do you need from me to work on this problem (and the others for that matter) with: any logs, tracing etc.?
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  • I’m frustrated
    I have only had this problem since I updated to Mavericks
    First time I tried to open Del 2-7 it appeared to be an empty library so I escaped
    The next time and there after, it was slow to load, then for a second I could move the mouse until the little scanner window appeared and then total freeze ,unable to quit so had to shut down

    I have Mac book pro version 10.9
    2.3 GHz intel core i7
    Memory 4GB 1600 MHz DDR3
    Graphics 4000 1024 MB
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  • Well, the same for me: the opening of DL2 crashes the whole system and I have no choice but to switch it off...
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  • I’m frustrated
    DL2 crashes my entire system and requires a hard reset upon launch.

    15-inch Mid 2012 MacBook Pro
    2.3 GHz Intel Core i7
    8GB 1600Mhz DDR3
    GeForce GT 650M 512MB

    OS X 10.9
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  • 1
    Hello:

    Is anyone at Delicious-Monster monitoring these travails? It's pretty darn serious when an application one has paid good money for no longer works just because the customers upgraded to a new version of the OS!

    Did the DL folks even test on Mavericks? I've been using it for months as a Mac dev and I can tell you I tested mine on it!

    C'mon DL folks, we've come to expect better than this from you!
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  • By the way Mavericks seems to have stuffed up my scanner . Should have learnt my lesson last time when I upgraded to Snow leopard I lost my entire Delicious library and had to start again
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  • Same problem. First launch of DL 2.8.1 after upgrade to Mavericks and it froze everything. After a forced restart of the system the library seemed to load, but many of the images were "glitchy" and within a few seconds everything froze hard again. I realise that stuff like this happens with major OS upgrade and I'm really hoping for a prompt fix. I use this to catalogue my library and to track books I loan out. I've got over 9,000 books in my DL library and I'd hate to lose the many hours over many years that it has taken to build and maintain the database.

    15" MacBook Pro - Mid 2012
    2.3ghz i7
    OS 10.9
    Delicious Library 2.8.1
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  • Enough of the forums are we going to figure out how to fix it ???
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  • I’m annoyed
    MacBook Pro Retina, Mid 2012
    Processor: 2.3GHz Intel Core i7
    Memory: 8GB 1600MHz DD3
    Graphics: Intel HD Graphics 4000 1024MB
    Software: OS X 10.9 (13A603)
    SMC: 2.3f36

    After opening library (DL 2) whole system freezes - no mouse or keyboard.
    Initially thought it was having camera open to scan barcode, but looking at everyones else's feedback it's probably not that
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  • 1
    Robyn: not sure what you mean by "we". The fact that DL "supports" their product by forums rather than direct product problem reporting (ie leaving it up to us to figure out a "solution" (laughable since we don't have the code or know what problem resolution tools are available for DL) shows they're really not that interested in supporting their product)).

    It appears they didn't even test on Mavericks: troubling since it's been available for six months or so.
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  • Hi All, 

    We do care about you and your ability to use Delicious Library. Unfortunately, some of the bugs are out of our hands and we have to rely on Apple to release the fix. As for a few others we are working on them and plan to release our update soon. Hopefully both our update and Apple's release will solve the issue entirely. 
    We're really sorry for the current state of un-usability. 
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  • I seem to have found a workaround. I launched Delicious Library 2 with the shift key held down. It gave me the option of rebuilding the database file, although no problems were found and it wasn't rebuilt. When the app loaded the book cover images were garbled, but as quickly as I possibly could I switched to "list" view in the view menu. I have no desire to push my luck and have kept my use of the app to a minimum, but I had no trouble entering 22 new books using the iSight barcode scanner and was able to update five loans...so it seems to be working in "list" mode.
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  • I’m unhappy
    1
    Since upgrading to Mavericks (and only since then) DL 3 crashes every time I attempt to scroll in any view pane.

    2012 15" MacBook Pro w/ Retina Display
    2.7 GHz, Intel Core i7
    16GB RAM
    NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M 1024 MB graphics
    OS X 10.9 (13A603)

    Here's the top of the stack of the thread that crashed:

    Crashed Thread: 0 Dispatch queue: com.apple.main-thread

    Exception Type: EXC_BAD_INSTRUCTION (SIGILL)
    Exception Codes: 0x0000000000000001, 0x0000000000000000

    Thread 0 Crashed:: Dispatch queue: com.apple.main-thread
    0 com.delicious-monster.library3 0x0000000100f97d9a 0x100f89000 + 60826
    1 com.apple.ExceptionHandling 0x00007fff8f30201a -[NSExceptionHandler _handleException:mask:] + 562
    2 com.apple.ExceptionHandling 0x00007fff8f301c71 NSExceptionHandlerUncaughtSignalHandler + 35
    3 libsystem_platform.dylib 0x00007fff915eb5aa _sigtramp + 26
    4 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x00001234402dd9d7 0x123440000000 + 3004887
    5 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x00001234402d9fc8 0x123440000000 + 2990024
    6 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x00001234402d9ddb 0x123440000000 + 2989531
    7 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x00001234402dd49d 0x123440000000 + 3003549
    8 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x00001234402dd2c0 0x123440000000 + 3003072
    9 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x00001234402de2e4 0x123440000000 + 3007204
    10 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x00001234402b8cac 0x123440000000 + 2854060
    11 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x00001234401f8732 0x123440000000 + 2066226
    12 com.apple.GeForceGLDriver 0x000012344030ca8f 0x123440000000 + 3197583
    13 GLEngine 0x00007fff92421fc9 gleGenMipmaps + 203
    14 GLEngine 0x00007fff923fe83d gleGenerateMipmap + 267
    15 GLEngine 0x00007fff9235d06b glGenerateMipmapEXT_Exec + 367
    16 com.apple.SceneKit 0x00007fff8bf7ea6f _C3DRendererContextFillTextureWithImage + 1618
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  • This reply was removed on 2013-11-13.
    see the change log
  • I’m frustrated
    Same thing happens for me. When I open DL2, my computer completely stops (although the fan does start up).

    I have a 2013 15" Macbook Pro Retina.
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  • None of the aforementioned workarounds have worked for me. I have DL3 on 10.9 and continue to get the symptoms (i.e. Doesn't crash (DL or Mac OS), but doesn't work either (i.e. At start-up I get a looping dialog box asking for iTunes location)). See my above posts.
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  • Well, I have a work-around of sorts. I found a recent (i.e. Before Mavericks) DL3 backup and have successfully restored it on a copy of DL3 I have running on my other Mac mini which will be kept on Mountain Lion for now ("now" being until this gets fixed on Mavericks).

    I'm still ever-hopeful that Apple gets 10.9.1 out "soon".
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  • I’m annoyed
    I just bought DL3 on Mavericks 10.9 and can't use it due to the glitches, crashes, and freezes. Hopefully this is fixed soon. Until then, I'm going back to DL2. I should've tried it before I bought it.

    Edit: It's running smoothly now after restarting.

    Like many others, I don't like that the Details Sidebar is gone. Even if I resize the details popup menu, it's way too big. You can't make it smaller.

    Also, all of my unbordered movies are distorted and stretched. I'll have to resize each and every one of them to get them to look normal.

    Edit: I resized everything by selecting them all and editing the selection's dimensions.

    The Audience option is only one line now. You can have multiple lines for the other things (genre, features, languages) but not Audience - not anymore! Please bring that option back.

    Lastly, in DL2 the white space around the movies was automatically removed. Now, they're back.
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  • We have reason to believe the fix will be out within the next month. Thanks for sticking with us!
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  • I’m frustrated
    Have anyone tested the Delicious Library 2 running on OS X Mavericks 10.9.1 Beta avaiable only to developers at this time?
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  • 1
    One would think that DL-Monsters have, um, since they're developers. Hopefully, they tested it one hell of a lot better than they did on 10.9! :0(((
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  • Running Mavericks on 2011 iMac 2.7Ghz i5 Quad with 4GB ram. DL 2.8.1 launched OK but has strange graphical glitches in shelf view that corrupt item cover art. If I switch to "Show as List" and then "Show as Covers" again, the covers get drawn correctly, for a while. Pretty annoying but thankfully not fatal like many of the respondents above.
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  • I just upgraded to 2.8.2 today, then opened the video barcode scanner to add a new book, only for DL to crash with the report saying:

    Application Specific Information:
    *** Terminating app due to uncaught exception 'CAInvalidCIFilter', reason '*** CI filters are not supported by this layer tree: {CIColorMonochrome {
    inputColor = "(1 1 1 1)";
    inputImage = "";
    inputIntensity = "0.7";
    }}.'

    Also: re-opening the program after the crash and saying 'Don't Reopen' windows doesn't close the video scanner, meaning that whenever I open DL now it immediately crashes. :-( (Deleting the preferences, cache, library or re-installing the application doesn't seem to close it either...)

    Using Mac OS X 10.9 (13A603) running on a mid-2010 15-inch MBP (2.66GHz i7, 8GB RAM, GeForce GT 330M 512 MB).
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  • Just upgraded to 2.8.3, and had a CTD. When loading back up, wood grain texture is missing. Library is still intact. Messages from console:

    12/3/13 9:56:06.389 AM Delicious Library 2[8279]: *** WARNING: -[NSImage compositeToPoint:operation:fraction:] is deprecated in MacOSX 10.8 and later. Please use -[NSImage drawAtPoint:fromRect:operation:fraction:] instead.

    12/3/13 9:56:06.389 AM Delicious Library 2[8279]: *** WARNING: -[NSImage compositeToPoint:fromRect:operation:fraction:] is deprecated in MacOSX 10.8 and later. Please use -[NSImage drawAtPoint:fromRect:operation:fraction:] instead.

    12/3/13 9:56:06.566 AM WindowServer[103]: disable_update_timeout: UI updates were forcibly disabled by application "Delicious Library" for over 1.00 seconds. Server has re-enabled them.

    12/3/13 9:56:06.914 AM WindowServer[103]: common_reenable_update: UI updates were finally reenabled by application "Delicious Library" after 1.35 seconds (server forcibly re-enabled them after 1.00 seconds)

    12/3/13 9:56:15.665 AM Delicious Library 2[8279]: deallocating NSDocument 0x1c46720

    12/3/13 9:56:25.198 AM Delicious Library 2[8289]: *** WARNING: -[NSImage compositeToPoint:operation:fraction:] is deprecated in MacOSX 10.8 and later. Please use -[NSImage drawAtPoint:fromRect:operation:fraction:] instead.

    12/3/13 9:56:25.198 AM Delicious Library 2[8289]: *** WARNING: -[NSImage compositeToPoint:fromRect:operation:fraction:] is deprecated in MacOSX 10.8 and later. Please use -[NSImage drawAtPoint:fromRect:operation:fraction:] instead.

    I'm on 10.9 (13A603); Mac Pro 3,1; 2 x 2.8 quad-core xeon; 6GB ram; Radeon HD 5770 1024 MB
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  • DL 2.8.3 is worse for me under Mavericks then before. Scanning barcodes adds items to the bottom of the window, but the window always jumps to the top, which is annoying. Covers also still don't always look correct and look black and white and crappy. It hung on launch once.

    2.8.2 had similar visual glitches but not the other glitches.
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  • So in a last ditch attempt to try and get this working, I decided to run DL3 on Mountain Lion system to export the library and then install it on a copy of Mavericks 10.9.1 which I am testing my own software on. The idea here was to see if I could run the actual DL3 library under DL3 using the database which currently worked; this would "prove" that it was the code or not and not a corrupted database (or some element thereof).

    So when I fired up DL3 on my Mountain Lion system it asked to update as a new version (3.1.2) was available (that version I used on ML was from the Delicious Monster website and not the Apple Mac store). As expected DL3 ran just fine (because it had in the past run with no problems on Mountain Lion) and I was in fact able to export that copy of my database.

    So, just on a whim, I decided to try that database on Mavericks 10.9 with the delicious library app file copied from my ML system to my Mavericks 10.9 system. You can imagine my surprise when everything started up and even though I still got the repetitive window problem still asking for access to my iTunes library, I was able to cancel out of that request and go back to the main window where I could now access my DL3 database. All I can say is “yippie!” I have yet to test my working DL3 database on the 10.9.1 system to see if I still get those annoying where-is-the iTunes library requests (which used to hang indefinitely). I shall do so and report back anything I find that might be of use to anyone else who has been a victim of the travails outlined in this problem incident.

    I guess the point here for those others in this incident who have been having their systems "freeze" or "lockup" (which is most likely a UNIX panic) it doesn't look like there is a generalized problem on 10.9 per se. I of course cannot explain why the 3.1.2 version of DL3 worked, so all I can say is that it did. Irrespective of whether this now works on 10.9.1, it does work on 10.9; add to that that I have never suffered from a system-wide lock-up/freeze, my report here is probably of not much value to those who are suffering that scenario.

    So, even though this does look like a rather lengthy dissertation which may or may not be relevant to anyone else other than myself, the bottom line is that it at least works now for me so I will now be signing off from this problem assuming that everything stays all right. The only reason why I may comment further is to report any anomalies running DL3 on 10.9.1. I certainly hope the rest of your here do get this working for you.
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  • DL 2 crashes my computer every time it opens - same issue as every other user - I don't want to upgrade to DL3. How long before this is sorted?
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  • This reply was removed on 2013-12-12.
    see the change log
  • 12/12/2013 09:02:41,638 Delicious Library 3[1025]: Unable to simultaneously satisfy constraints:
    (
    "",
    "",
    ""
    )

    Will attempt to recover by breaking constraint

    Set the NSUserDefault NSConstraintBasedLayoutVisualizeMutuallyExclusiveConstraints to YES to have -[NSWindow visualizeConstraints:] automatically called when this happens. And/or, break on objc_exception_throw to catch this in the debugger.
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  • Push. Same with me. DL2 brings my whole system down. This makes me sad and angry. Why does it take so long to fix this?
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  • 1
    I had the problem of DL2 freezing my entire system and forcing a reboot. I downloaded version 2.8.5 (from http://delicious-monster.com/get/ ) and installed it on top of the version I had installed. This fixed it for me, and my library is intact.
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  • Hi everyone,

    While we are still waiting for Apple to fix the graphics bug which is causing your crashes in Delicious Library 3 on OS X Mavericks (10.9), we have a beta version which may prevent some crashes (but is slower and draws uglier for now).

    The link to the beta is: http://www.delicious-monster.com/down...

    The beta also fixes some other bugs. See the release notes here: http://www.delicious-monster.com/rele...

    Thanks for your patience, and please let us know how the beta goes for you!

    Mila
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  • I’m baffled
    Mila, I expect anyone who realises they can now download a fully-working copy of the latest version of your software without paying will be ecstatic!

    I paid for DL2 and DL3 ; the former was publicly offered up as a download a few weeks ago, and now DL3 as well...

    Perhaps there is a good reason why it couldn't be done, but I feel it would have been better for you and your existing customer base if you had pushed these updates via iTunes and any email addresses you have from private sales, rather than making the downloads available to all. It renders any attempt you have made to avoid piracy completely pointless and, although you are covered legally, I expect both DL2 and DL3 are already available for download from so many "sites of dubious purpose" that you'd have a hard time finding them all.

    If we go back to the source of the initial problem, which is that DM didn't properly test the software on Mavericks before rolling it out (I don't think you can blame Apple because I would assume that what Apple has released is pretty much the same as you were offered for testing), and then consider the issue of the lack of customer service after that (e.g. being told to watch for updates on your blog, when you actually didn't update it and made the announcements on Twitter instead!), it seems to me that DM has a lot to think about when the dust settles.

    BUT, thank you for at least giving us a temporary fix. It is very much appreciated.
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  • I totally agree with the previous responder. If you will go back and look at my posts you would see that all along I have said the same thing: your respective of whether the original bug was with Apple or not, adequate/complete testing of the product under Mavericks should've shown this bug BEFORE it was released to the customer base. If this software had been under my watch, I would be severely dressing down the anyone in charge of and a member of the QA planning/staffing (Including product or development management) of this product. And, I would be letting them know in no uncertain terms that this it better not happen again.
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  • Please understand, we’re only a three person company. We don’t have the resources to immediately find and work around bugs that even get past Apple. This bug is only on certain machines, and we didn’t even use those machines. It took us a long time to even form a theory of WHAT was crashing the drivers—we don’t have access to their code or anything.

    This bug was in two versions of Mavericks, which was put out by the company with the most resources in the world. They have admitted as much, they have fixed it internally.

    I feel a bit as if I can’t win, here. We found the bug for Apple, we reported it to them, we worked with them to get it reproduced, we finally diagnosed what hardware is causing it, we figured out which low-level call in OpenGL is causing it, and then we spent a bunch of effort on coming up with a workaround when 10.9.1 didn’t ship with the patches.

    I guess I’m at a loss as to know what I could have done better.

    Also, @shoe, as far as I know this beta version still checks licenses.

    -Wil
    Chief Monster
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  • This is the second update that didn't address my complaints. Allison acknowledged them and gave me hope each time that you guys would make the corrections, but the fact that you still haven't after three months and two updates makes me lose hope. I really don't want to have to go back to DL2 but there have only been baffling omissions in DL3 instead of improvements. I'm reposting my complaints below again as I've done in other threads, in the hopes that they'll someday get fixed. I understand that you're only three people, but I feel my input is just being ignored month after month. For the record I'm on Mavericks with DL 3.1.5.

    https://getsatisfaction.com/delicious...

    -Unbordered artwork leaves unattractive white areas that weren't in DL2.



    -I resized the Details Popup to try to recreate the old Details Sidebar, but it's too big. I can't make it smaller. It's bigger than the old sidebar which means less screen space for the actual shelf.

    -The Audience option has been reduced to one line. Other options like Edition, Genres, and Features still let you use multiple lines. I had multiple lines for the Audiences because I entered rating descriptors.

    -The Books, Music, and Video Game shelves from the left side are gone. Now I have to click on Library then click on the small icon on the bottom.
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    • If you say “unbordered” in DL3 it means something different. We don’t have true unbordered items any more, because we thought nobody used them and we couldn’t figure out how to make them work with the 3D items. So, yah, right now if you don’t like our 3D items, you’re kind of stuck.

      The Audience being one line is just a mistake. I’ll file this one in our “to do” list. [By the way, if you mail bugs individually it makes it easy on us, because we can file the approved ones directly into the “do this” list and work on them from that.]

      I can also look at making the inspector go thinner, I don’t think we’re hampered there, we just picked a value we thought was sane. Do you have a number of pixels in mind?
    • Wait, you and Allison told me that the white areas are in fact removed in DL3. It sounds like you're saying they aren't. For me, they definitely aren't, as shown in the pics I've posted. If it's true, that sucks. I used/use them. Not using "unbordered" often results in the artwork not looking good because there are all sorts of packaging besides the generic Blu-ray amaray case. So DL tries to "fit" different packaging inside of that standard Blu-ray case. Examples of how unbordered is better (except for the white areas that weren't in DL2):



      Unbordered was awesome because you weren't restrained by that DVD/Blu-ray case and there was "an algorithm to cut out white space and to make the image fit into the correct format" (https://getsatisfaction.com/delicious...). I don't care about 3D items or tons of different shelf colors if it comes at the cost of more important aesthetics. Now I have some unappealing 3D items instead of intuitive items.

      Thank you. I mailed bugs individually last night.

      As for the inspector, I don't know much about pixels. I just know that in DL2 the sidebar was smaller so there was more room for the shelves. In DL3 I have room for three items per shelf at a comfortable size, whereas in DL2 I had room for four.

      Also, I forgot to mention how the zoom bar is gone at the bottom as well. Any reason behind moving that? It's just another example of how in DL3 there are extra steps to reach things that were already in a convenient location (like the Books, Video Games, and Music shelves). I'll submit a bug for this tonight.
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  • Wil,

    Thanks for taking the time to write an honest response so we can see things from your side. I realise that you are a small company and I know it is hard work because I've been running one of those since 1997. If I may make a couple of suggestions:

    1. Looking in from the outside, some of us can see that you didn't have the processes in place to juggle taking care of customers while trying to fix the software. Broken software happens so, when you guys come up for air, put some processes in place that someone can easily follow while you sort out the more tricky stuff. The processes should be so clearly laid out that you could hire temps with the right skills to get on with them.

    2. It seems that what you need is a bigger testing team. Why not recruit some of your customer base as beta testers? A lot of your users seem very enthusiastic about your product too...

    I also posted a longer set of feedback points on another thread a few weeks ago. The thing that bothered me the most personally was that you were still selling the software with the knowledge that so many of us couldn't get it to work on Mavericks. Anyway, as far as my thoughts on the subject are concerned, feel free to use what you like, or not if it doesn't fit in with your way of running things.

    Regarding the beta license check, I've performed a quick test and still think you need to go and check it's doing what you expect. I won't post any more here without your permission for obvious reasons.

    Hope this helps.
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    • 1. My experience suggests that you can indeed find plenty of people who are of the right calibre and the right price to work on this type of code, although I appreciate that what you might actually mean is that it would not be cost effective for you to employ someone to do that on the off-chance that it would come in handy. I agree, and I wasn't asking you to do so. Rather, I was talking about putting all kinds of processes in place to cover a range of issues, but in particular, customer service. Another example: in your earlier reply to andrewdollarmedia, you stated that you expect us to report bugs via the software, but could you just look up to the top of this page and see who started this thread by asking for bug reports to be given right here?! You guys need to agree on what you are doing and how you intend to go about it. Processes.

      2. It doesn't need to be thankless. Why not offer incentives to encourage the beta testers to work harder or, better still, to encourage those with the correct skills to step forward. The fact that you have managed to gather 100 testers means you must have some magic up your sleeve - how about a hall of fame for testers who have found the most bugs? There are loads of things you can do that don't cost anything to put in place. Obviously, that's just one thing that's worked for me in the past, but you need to keep it fresh and interesting. The more canny among us actually put one of the testers in charge of organising the others (for free)... ;o)

      Finally, I did indeed see the blog post you mention from 9 December, but you haven't actually updated that blog since then. It would have been really useful if you could have posted to the blog again each time there was a new download, but it seems it all happened on Twitter instead. I understand that several people emailed DM and were told to watch the blog, but the blog didn't say to watch Twitter for updates as well. I didn't even know you had a Twitter account until another user (as opposed to someone from DM) posted the download link to this site.

      Bottom line: not all of the problems were Apple's fault. You've got a great piece of software, your users seem to love you even when it goes wrong, and you're getting free advice from several of us that you can use to make things better if you want to use it. You said earlier that you didn't see how you could win, but it actually looks to me like you're doing alright out of this. I'm not going to thank you again because we all did that when we paid to download your software. Now, grab your belt loops, pull yourself up and just get it all sorted! ;oP
    • Yes, you’re right, she never got how things worked, which is why she’s gone. Your ideas about getting more beta testers are cool, we’ll see if we can’t do something like that.
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