Case study: how IMDb "splits" a company into 20 different ones!

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  • Updated 7 months ago
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This is a lab company, and one of the most prestigious in the world of cinema. IMDb lists 603 movies to its credit.
This is the result of: producers imagination when writing the end credits, IMDb contributors mistaking a physical address for part of the company's name; IMDb's contributers missing easy to read instructions about how to enter a Laboratory name; and last but not the least, IMDb lacking an auditing facility on its own lists, and not providing its contributors with a search facility on labs as it does for Miscellaneous Companies.


20 L.T.C. [fr]
11 L.T.C. Franay St. Cloud [fr]
1 L.T.C. Laboratories, Paris, France
9 L.T.C. Saint-Cloud [fr]
39 L.T.C. Saint-Cloud, France
7 Laboratoire Franay LTC
17 Laboratoire L.T.C. [fr]
5 Laboratoires de Tirages Cinématographiques, St. Cloud, Paris, France
1 Laboratoires Franay (L.T.C.), France
1 Laboratoires Franay des Tirages Cinématographiques (LTC) S.à.r.l., Saint-Cloud, Paris, Île-de-France, France
1 Laboratoires Franay L.T.C. [fr]
29 Laboratoires Franay L.T.C. Saint-Cloud
8 Laboratoires Franay LTC, Saint-Cloud, France
1 Laboratoires L.T.C. Franay [fr]
75 Laboratoires LTC, Paris, France
352 Laboratoires LTC, St. Cloud, France
5 LTC Franay [fr]
3 LTC Saint-Cloud
13 LTC, Paris
5 LTC/Scanlab, France


The company's legal name, in a Court decision:
https://www.legifrance.gouv.fr/affichJuriJudi.do?idTexte=JURITEXT000007204380


The company's registry of commerce:
https://www.societe.com/societe/societe-laboratoires-franay-tirages-cinematographiques-ltc-saint-clo...


Lots of info (in French) about LTC
https://www.afcinema.com/LTC-1676.html?lang=fr


A bit on LTC's sad end (in French)
https://www.afcinema.com/LTC-Guy-Laine-fondateur-de-GLPP-GLPIPA-temoigne.html?lang=fr


Conclusion: IMDb should list LTC as...
Laboratoires Franay Tirages Cinematographiques LTC
aka LTC
branch Saint-Cloud
address 19 rue Marius Franay
city Paris
postal code 92210 Saint-Cloud
country France


I rest my case.

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Artemis-9

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Posted 9 months ago

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Vincent Fournols

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Take also into account that the company has had a heavy economic history, often changing hands and names.... So some of the ones you listed may be accurate at the time of the related title.
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Jeorj Euler

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Hi, Vincent Fournols. The various names are supposed to be differentiated via the applications "as" attributes. There should be one entry per organizational entity cataloged on IMDb, except as far as "parent" company and "child" company go.
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Artemis-9

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You're right, Jeorg Euler, and the "as" could be used in some cases, after deleting the address locations (Franay, St. Cloud, Paris, France, etc.).
What Vincent Fournols said about the company "changing hands", and possible modifications of the company's name, does not apply to all the cases I mentioned.
By the way, the 5 instances with «LTC/Scanlab, France» denote an error, in which two different companies, LTC and Scanlab, were crushed into one, as they were two different companies which started and ended separately...
I believe this is one of those occasions that requires the intervention of IMDb staff and tools, above a bona fide contributor's.
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Jeorj Euler

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Contributors cannot merge entries about companies anyway, so there was never any question that the IMDb staff would have to resolve this.
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Vincent Fournols

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BTW, the line "city Paris" at the end is completely irrelevant and useless!
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Michelle, Official Rep

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Hi Artemis-9 -

Thanks for your report, in general anytime you see companies that require a merge it's best to report them within our Contact Form following the selection: IMDb Fan/Contributor Questions --> Company data --> Merge company pages and our staff will take a look.  In this case, as it involves a large clean-up, I have filed a ticket with the applicable editorial team, they will take a look as soon as they can.
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Artemis-9

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Thank you, Michelle, for your action, and reply.
My trouble is that there are two many doors to knock when a contributor wants to put a hard question to IMDb staff, and I tend not to find the right one at some instance.
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Eboy

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Truth to be told, some of these ”company” names can be tricky since there can be several names during the years. Is it a same company, or maybe another subsidiary company etc? What is the correct way to spell the name? Stuff like that.

Often the contributors don’t know - or at least are not sure, so they add the name as a ”new” company just to be sure. Things can get more complicated with the non-English companies, and even more complicated with some of these government offices and such.

Am I correct assuming that the ”company” name in its original language is the ”official” one (and others should be listed with ”as...” attribute)?

So the official name for (e.g.) the orchestra from Paris is ”Orchestre de Paris” and not, for example, ”The Paris Symphony Orchestra”?

And the official name for the Italian tourist board is ”Agenzia nazionale italiana del turismo (ENIT)”, and not (e.g.) ”Italian National Tourist Board (ENIT)”?
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Artemis-9

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The question you raise first does not apply in this case. The company was created and kept it's name throughout it's life. My option was for the long official name, that I propose to IMDb staff in my post above, that I took from this commercial registry: https://www.societe.com/societe/societe-laboratoires-franay-tirages-cinematographiques-ltc-saint-clo... 
I know very well, from dozens of movies and TV shows, that each film director used a variety of logo compositions (L.T.C. Franay, etc...) or simply the "pet name" LTC. Those are the versions to be kept with "as".
In my opinion, it's better than IMDb suggesting its new contributors a choice of dozens "different companies" that are... the same.
Is this an "objective" choice? N-o-o-o... It's my choice, because IMDb does not have a norm to write company names. This other commercial registry opts to place the acronym (which is also a logo) LTC before the company name, I think it is also a valid choice, but it's not mine. See:  https://services.e-pro.fr/hauts-de-seine/l-t-c-societe-laboratoires-franay-tirages-cinematographique...
By the way, according to a reliable French source I mentioned above, LTC was sold in the end 1980's to VDM [fr], but the original name was preserved at least until 2005 (last data on the net), so IMDb could as well create a link from the one-and-only LTC as "subsidiary of VDM [fr]".

The examples you give for non-English language companies or entities is more difficult to deal with, and can only be solved with a little search about their official registration name, or in the commercial registry, or the legal notice in their sites. It brings more work on IMDb contributors, for sure... 
For instance, in your second example, the "correct" name would be "ENIT - Agenzia Nazionale del Turismo" (see:  http://www.enit.it/en/agency/2652-natura-giuridica.html  ) probably entering an "as ENIT - Ente nazionale Italiano per il turismo" (note the capitalisation Italian style...) if the entry dates back to the first name of that agency. I see that Wikipedia notes it right:  https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agenzia_nazionale_italiana_del_turismo


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Eboy

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I believe IMDb prefers that the (official) company name is listed first and the abbreviation, if any, comes after that in brackets.

Example: ”American Broadcasting Company (ABC) [us]”

In your example ”ENIT - Agenzia Nazionale del Turismo" the abbreviation is listed first and I believe that’s not correct (note: from the IMDb point of view).

(This Italian ”company” was basically just an random example, and I know very little about it. I’m not fully sure how the official name is spelled. Or what is the official abbreviation.

But it’s these type of examples that can be tricky when people are submitting credits and there are 20 Italian companies listed in the ”Thanks” section of some Italian film. You do the best you can - and then you move on. That’s the reality.)
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Jayseph, Employee

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Hi Artemis-9,

Many thanks for flagging. Apologies for the delay, and many thanks for your patience whilst we investigated.

So we do have some formatting guidelines when it comes to Laboratory submissions;

Format: Laboratory Name, Location, Country.
Please include the state abbreviation if in the USA.
Examples:DeLuxe, Hollywood (CA), USATechnicolor, Vancouver, Canada Technicolor, Bangkok, Thailand
So to align with that, I have tweaked your suggestion to;

Laboratoires Franay Tirages Cinematographiques (LTC), Paris, France

I've updated the 600+ items from your list to show this name instead.

As an added bonus, as it took me a while to realise that your initial list referred to Tech Info: Laboratory items rather than Company Filmo credits, I've also consolidated a few duplicate company pages into a single listing as well.

I've aligned this company name with your suggestion and this page can now be found here.

Many thanks again for raising this.

Jay
(Edited)
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ACT_1

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Hi! Jayseph, Employee

( Note: ACT_1 is not a IMDb Pro )

https://pro.imdb.com/company/co0050341/filmography
Become a IMDb Pro Member today

https://www.imdb.com/company/co0050341/filmography
The requested URL was not found on our server

https://www.imdb.com/company/co0050341/
goes to ...

https://www.imdb.com/search/title?companies=co0050341
With Laboratoires Franay Tirages Cinematographiques (LTC)
(Sorted by Popularity Ascending)
116 titles.
- - -

https://getsatisfaction.com/imdb/topics/change-to-the-company-links-on-the-site
Change to the company links on the site

Earlier today we made an update to the site
so that when you click on a company link
you will be taken to a list of titles from that company.
The list of titles is generated using Advanced Title Search.
This is a change from recent behavior of when clicking on a company link
you were taken to IMDbPro.

Posted 3 weeks ago - Nov 12 2018
Chris H., Official Rep

- - -

? ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?search=Laboratoires+Franay+Tirages+Cinematographiques+LTC

.

(Edited)