Character Role Formatting through contract or call sheet

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  • Updated 6 months ago
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Dear imdb staff, I have an uncredited role in Criminal Minds https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1713134/

My credit is Man on sidewalk. Yet i have a documentation provided by the company, where is shows they granted me the name Carlos, i have on pdf. sent by them.

If i present it, will it suffice to simply correct the name and keep it uncredited?

please respond
thnks


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MC

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  • very confused

Posted 6 months ago

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MAthePA

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Hi, MC.

Please don't consider my word as an "aye" or "nay" vote for your main idea. 
I'm just trying to express more behind the scene of this process.

IMDb exists not only for cast and crew members; it is for viewers initially. When a cast or crew member is not credited (no name printed in the titles sequence), he/she is welcomed to be included into the base as "uncredited". 

For crew members the docs you are referring to are self-explaining. When adding an uncredited cast member, their roles must be explained in the most obvious way to let the viewers know which person is meant. If taking your current example, a viewer (contributor) may spend a lot of time for nothing then searching for a "Carlos" -- whether it is imprinted on his T-shirt, or someone calls him Carlos in a scene, or else... To avoid such problems, there is an IMDb practice to use objective descriptions, such as "Man on sidewalk" -- the man is much easier to recognize this way.

In view of all the above, I think that IMDb could inherit the names out of contracts or call-sheets, but in such case the documents should be attached to the titles in the base. Logically speaking, such approach would be much complicated for the base maintainers as well as for users.

Thank you for understanding.
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MC

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Thank you, so after viewing your wonderful response, could i be clarified if my documentation could support simply altering the character name to Carlos?

you stated could inherit the names out of contracts or call sheets. I have letter, contract through them.

Please let me know, im trying everything to change the name to what was given to me and i have the documentation to prove this.
not a liar reason why i have all docs to support my statement.
(Edited)
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MAthePA

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I am plus one person in this thread to know the official response.
Let's both of us stay patient waiting for an "Employee" or "Official Rep." coming here.
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MC

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Thank you.

Again have letter pdf from production company
Contract signed with them
Everything sent by them
Which will divulge sensitive old information about me but if it’s necessary so be it

Whatever suffices to prove I’m truthful honest person
IMDb thinks I’m a liar clearly and or I’m playing games br>I’m not, never been. Only showing can prove that.

Again not trying to be complicated
Just show everything everyone to see I’m honest and telling the truth.
(Edited)
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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The issue is not the info you have for verification.
The issue is format policy and rules guidelines.
This is all they will explain.
A yes or no, determining if you can or can't change it.
Be patient and wait.
You are restating things you have already said at the top.
Please don't reply.
Ongoing dialog delays the response by staff.
Lets all not type a thing and wait for IMDb please.

Thanks

Ed

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Jeorj Euler

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Come to think of it, there could be an issue with "Self" credits in fictional material.
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MC

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Well I guess he did reply. Since he commented lol, can I post my contract and letter here from the company?
(Edited)
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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No employee has replied. Wait. Be patient. Don't clutter the post with unasked for info at this time.
Remember every reply means ongoing dialog.
Ongoing dialog = delay in Employee responding. It may be 24 hours from now before an employee replies.

(Edited)
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Adrian, Champion

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Did you try to edit the page? I just went in and submitted and edit to change your character name to "Carlos". Since you did not have an onscreen credit, there is no conflict with what was show on screen.

If your name was never used in the episode, it would have been impossible for a contributor to know that your character was named "Carlos" and they went with a description instead.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Adrian. His submission with the name "Carlos" was denied 3 times by staff. With your submission history they will undoubtedly accept it on your status here alone.
Thank you..........I think. At least it will make Mannie (MC) happy
Cheers

Ed
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Adrian, Champion

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I have no idea why they would decline it. It seems that if the character name is not listed on screen that it can be just about anything.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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P.S. I was the submitter. I watched the episode and contributed it and staff accepted it.
Here is the screenshot.
https://getsatisfaction.com/imdb/topics/new-criminal-minds-credit-from-2011-keeps-getting-automatica...







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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Adrian, I saw the reason why in the help guide with in the submission form (Not in the help topics). Those guidelines state that unless the uncredited role is clearly identifiable by name (IE: Name spoken, or by way of a uniform or name tag) then it shall be as listed as what the person in the uncredited role was doing. Would have preferred for an answer from staff which is why this post was created.
To get staff to give a clear definition for Mannie.

Elizabeth concurred and approved the credit finally. The staff has had all of his "Evidence and ruled that it was not enough reason to credit him as "Carlos"

Thanks
Cheers

Ed.



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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Great work Adrian
Cool

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Adrian, Champion

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I'm not sure that I've ever used that help and it seems a lot of times that the help on the submission guide is outdated. If that is the rule for uncredited characters, then the vast majority of uncredited characters on TV shows are listed wrong. :D
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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If I was a fan of Mannie and I wanted to find him in that episode and I watched intently waiting for a character to say the name Carlos to another character and never heard the name spoken I would be scratching my head saying to myself, "he was never in this episode." That fan may now submit a deletion based on that alone! But if he was just listed as "Man on sidewalk', that would signify he was not spoken to. So his part is small enough that I (Hypothetical fan) will look for his face instead, in any sidewalk scenes. Viola! I see him! I'm happy that I saw my favorite actor because IMDb had listed him the best way possible to high-lite (Identify) that actors contribution.
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Adrian, Champion

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I can go either way on this. "Man on sidewalk" probably isn't unique enough to identify someone without more help. That's just my opinion. I rarely delete uncredited people unless they are credited with something like "Wedding Guest" in an episode/movie without a wedding.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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This episode was about a sniper shooting people on the streets.
Undoubtedly Mannie was one of 50 or so uncredited that had the same assignment. He is one of the 4 out of the 50. I'd wan't to be found and seen. Carlos does not do it.
Man on sidewalk clearly does.
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MC

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Mr Ed please don’t do anything else lol
Adrian just made me feel so happy thank you
Ed this is what I mean Adrian went to the extent of making this small action for me and made me feel so happy
I’m thrilled
Gave me a huge smile
Thank you thank you thank you
I can go back to work now
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Adrian, Champion

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So, it was just that easy to change.


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MC

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Guys I just finished work all I can say it
Thank you Mr Adrian
From the bottom of my heart for doing that
I don’t have enough thank you words to express my gratitude
Thank you deeply truly and wholeheartedly
Thank you beyond measure.
Yes Mr Ed it made me extremely happy
Thank you so so much
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ljdoncel, Champion

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Hi, Adrian:
If that is the rule for uncredited characters...
In fact it is...

It seems that if the character name is not listed on screen that it can be just about anything.
I'm sure you've been well-meaning and I absolutely have nothing against Mannie, but I think you've made a mistake this time... I agree with you that the guides probably have some outdated aspects, but the spirit of the rule for cases like this is clearly helping the user identify the actor who's portraying a role that, in the absence of a descriptive character name, would be impossible to locate (MAthePA and Ed have also commented on this).

This is a clear example. Below is the whole screentime of Mannie in the episode:

No dialogue, no reference by name in no way, just a (very respectable) extra part of a "Man on sidewalk" with 7 seconds of screentime because he's incidentally walking by the **spoiler** killer...

Sorry, but I think that "Carlos", regardless Mannie's contract may read, is not what should expect as his character name for this title (IMHO).

Also to be noted that the real reason behind Mannie's claim is that his entry doesn't look like an extra work, not just to match his documents.
i was just trying to find a way to change the name to Carlos or something less vague because it clearly shows its extra work that way and it very bad.
I'm happy Mannie is happy, but I don't think this is a good precedent for future cases.

Finally,
If that is the rule for uncredited characters, then the vast majority of uncredited characters on TV shows are listed wrong.
That's why we contributors try to correct those errors when we detect them. Maybe should be more vigilant with these entries, true, but no system is perfect...
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MC

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Gentleman thank you all for the help
Thank you for the trouble
I leave you to it
Simply waiting to get a response regarding the support contact question
But apart from that thank you for everything
Teaching and clarifying
Thank you all
Bless your hearts
Bless your soul
Mr Adrian thank you immensely for helping me and making my day 10 times better
Ed thanks for trying your best
Ljdoncel thank you for everything you wrote
We learn and try our best
Thank you all very much
Have a lovely Monday
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Adrian, Champion

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Man on sidewalk does not clearly identify Mannie. Your 7 second clip shows how men on the sidewalk? The guide also doesn't clarify where a character name is known. It seems that we should ignore that and give them a description which is somewhat crazy. Here's a different part of the guide that seems to be in conflict of what you posted.

(uncredited) - No on-screen credit. For acting credits, this must include a character name or some kind of description. For further details, please see section E, 'Cast Attributes: uncredited' below.

and

If they are credited with such a character or role name, you are able to provide evidence and the credit does not appear on the site within 10 days, please contact our team using the form below with verifiable proof of the credit.

It seems Mannie has proof that he was credited was a character name, so this seems entirely the right thing to do.
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MC

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Thank you Adrian immensely for supporting me and being so elegantly helpful and truly deeply a gentleman and so so amazing about this

I seriously cannot thank you enough and if you were a live person I would buy you a beer just to show how deeply thankful and touched I’m by your help after all this clutter and discussion for days.

Mr Adrian bless your heart and soul for apparently being the only person who believe and wanted to help me with a great genuine loving heart

You really made my day.
Thank you. Yes I’m not a liar
Very honest person just dealing with this problem
There are thousands of uncredited roles online with names. Know st least 15 actors with that but won’t mention names

Once again master Adrian from my heart thank you immensely for helping me. I’m humbly marveled by you and your Excellence as a professional and human being
I could only wish I met more people like you, would be a daily blessing. I’m very lucky that you joined this chat to aid me and fix this. So so immensely grateful
(Edited)
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MC

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Jeorj Euler
Thank you as well for the responses, hope all have a glorious weekend with your familes, ate a lot and rested and has a magical weekend full of joy. I take my hat off to all. Thank you from the bottom of my soul again

have drained too much of your precious time on me, may you proceed in helping other actors the same way you helped me.

To you Sirs thank you Adrian you made my day in all honesty, gave me a smile and allowed to breathe.....bless you soul.

Gentleman, please proceed to superman saving other on this forum. Thank you all

Have an awesome beautiful day.
Bless your golden hearts.
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ljdoncel, Champion

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@Adrian:
Man on sidewalk does not clearly identify Mannie
A thousand times much more descriptive than "Carlos", which isn't heard/printed any single time in the episode...
Here's a different part of the guide that seems to be in conflict of what you posted. (uncredited) - No on-screen credit. For acting credits, this must include a character name or some kind of description. For further details, please see section E, 'Cast Attributes: uncredited' below.
The guide is simply saying that (uncredited) cast entries with a blank character field won't be accepted. It doesn't oblige to enter a proper name.
If they are credited with such a character or role name, you are able to provide evidence and the credit does not appear on the site within 10 days, please contact our team using the form below with verifiable proof of the credit.
Please, read carefully (and post) the full sentence...

The paragraph refers to likely (uncredited) entries which are being submitted as credited without the proper attribute, to explain that the editors will be a priori more reluctant to accept them...
It seems Mannie has proof that he was credited was a character name, so this seems entirely the right thing to do.
You're veteran and knowledgeable enough to know that "credited", on terms, means something different to what documents or contracts show: "identified either by a caption or spoken name", which doesn't happen in this case.
(Edited)
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MC

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Gentleman, is there any way to ask imdb to close this thread?

or make it solved?

since with the most gracious heart it was solved.
Fyi Photo of ljdoncel



 ljdoncel, Champion to make it clear for you. thank you Sir, i said something less vague yet i do have documentation to prove it, always had.

I have it proved, maybe what i said came across as if i just wanted to change for the sake of image and look...which is beyond superficial indeed it is but documentation to support it i have it or else i wouldnt be here wasting your precious time

while u could be helping hundreds of other people with other very important matters
i never play with people and gamble, im a man of truth and yes im here becsuse i have those docs like i always do.

So yes as Adrian and myself said i have documentation to prove this.

And im deeply grateful he fixed it for me

thank you

So now we may close this thread or ask imdb to have it solved.
so you may direct your attentions to many other people who need your help and guidance.
(Edited)
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Mannie
Glad you got what you wanted.
I doubt anyone here will correct the mistake made.
But don't be surprised that someday that credit gets altered.
Like I said, No One Here will probably change it.
I would ask you to please in the future be a little nicer to people that have never given up on trying to help you.
Your treatment of the people on this whole matter has been less than exemplary.
You have been very nice on this post.
But the others!!!!
Please be kinder.
Thanks
Cheers
Ed
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MC

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Dear Mr Ed,

I believe previously i have apologies for my initial approach 3 times havent i? i did :) plus i have apologised for that over and over and accepted what i have done....

maybe you missed reading that in that case, for eht 4th time i deeply am sorry for the way i initiated it, you are completely right, we all make mistakes, no one is perfect, we are a bag of bones and blood that somehow functions in a miraculous way, we learn every day, we all makes mistakes don't we?

im certain you yourself have done so and apologized, well i will gladly admit i did and apologized and learned not to do it again.

Listen as far as im aware, from the 2nd portion of the other thread i have been nothing but nice and diplomatic and trying to reason. this post was created given your indications so im following lead and learning like we all do everyday.

Mr ED, on the other posts, in the beginning yes i wasnt that diplomatic and i ADMIT, i was very frustrated and annoyed, im human, i make mistakes, are we perfect? no we are not but we learn and yes when people are frustrated they type differently.

I'm always very nice, i work in public relations for USC, costumer service with HUNDREDS of international sudents.

So im known to be loving and kind always.

I can only hope no one here changes it and leaves it alone,
i would be immensel gratefull.

To all i bid you Sirs gooday, thank you very much
and thank you

Anyways Mr Ed i will leave you in peace and wont be disturbing you any time soon.
Again i could give you 15 people to talk to who would vouch for me, my professionalism and my persona and reason why i work with internationals, im wonderful to all.
cheers to all
Mr Adrian bless your soul for being a champion of help
you really made me happy. Thank you so much
i wish i could pay you back in some way really do.
cheers take care everyone
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Thanks.
Maybe we will run into each other.
I'm in the L.A. Area looking for voice over work.
Cheers
Ed
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MC

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Break a leg :)
I did voice over for a video game last year
Nimbus só hope you get some work soon cheers best to you
To Adrian and ljoncel
Cheers boys :))
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Will, Official Rep

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(Edited)

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