Dmitri Hvorostovsky

  • 3
  • Question
  • Updated 3 months ago
  • Answered
  • (Edited)
At https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0404835/
his name is listed as Dmitriy Khvorostovskiy, 
but on 24 of his 27 credits, he's got attribute "as Dmitri Hvorostovsky".
I'm willing to bet the other 3 should be that as well.

If you search Google for Dmitriy Khvorostovskiy, 
it comes back with:
Showing results for Dmitri Hvorostovsky
Search instead for Dmitriy Khvorostovskiy
And lists
Dmitri Hvorostovsky
hvorostovsky.com/
Official website for Siberian baritone Dmitri Hvorostovsky.

Amazon.com has 0 results for Dmitriy Khvorostovskiy, 
but 846 for what IMDb uses as an "alternate".
https://smile.amazon.com/s?k=Dmitri+Hvorostovsky

When he made #28 of People Magazine's 1991 list of 50 Most Beautiful People, the spelling was NOT the title of his IMDb page.
https://people.com/archive/dmitri-hvorostovsky-opera-baritone-28/

So why does IMDb have this alternate spelling as his primary name?

Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes

Posted 3 months ago

  • 3
Photo of MAthePA

MAthePA

  • 1928 Posts
  • 3297 Reply Likes
Hi, bderoes.

There is no single variant to transliterate a cyrillic spelling into latin. Each country where the cyrillic is in use, may have or have not an official set of rules for this matter, but all of them have no unified system for transliteration. IMDb uses Klingon to transliterate the cyrillic. There are two great translators for this: Google and Bing.

Anyway, the Google kindly suggests the alternate variants that are more popular or relevant when searching. So, we'll not be lost )))

Moreover, the alternate spelling is attached to his page:
(Edited)
Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes
Of course the spelling used by Amazon, People, Google, everyone is attached to his page. It appears 24 times (out of 27) as the way he is officially credited on each title.

Perhaps I should have also cited the NY Times:
Dmitri Hvorostovsky, Silver-Maned Baritone From Siberia, Dies at 55 ...
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/22/arts/music/dmitri-hvorostovsky-dead.html
Nov 22, 2017 - Dmitri Hvorostovsky, the charismatic Siberian baritone who won critical acclaim and devoted fans around the world for his burnished voice, uncanny breath control and rueful expressivity, died on Wednesday in London. He was 55.

It looks to me that IMDb's choice for "primary" is inappropriate when virtually all his credits use the SAME "alternate", the spelling that his official website uses.
Photo of MAthePA

MAthePA

  • 1928 Posts
  • 3297 Reply Likes
I would not be so fast to say what is (in-)appropriate on this matter, because there are a way more complicated examples of this same problem -- we may start with Pyotr Chaykovskiy / Chaikovsky / Csajkovszky / Tchaikovsky / Tschaikowsky / Tschaikowskij / and more... who had died before the first movie referenced to him as composer.
(Edited)
Photo of Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin)

Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

  • 2674 Posts
  • 3434 Reply Likes
Adding to what MAthePA said one single name in Russian can be transliterated in like five different variants minimum, with personal preference outweighing the rules. 

For example, despite my Ukrainian name is Mykola due to my mixed roots I also use a Russian variant Nikolay (especially since I was named after my grandfather). That name alone can be written (depending on who writes) as Nicolai, Nikolai, Nikolay, Nicolay and I still encounter new variants to this day. I might not agree with some of the transliteration rules from Ukrainian but such are, at least, way more fixed and clear then the Russian ones. 
Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes
I understand that part of the issue is the translation from one alphabet to the other.
That explains why he has 2 spellings of his name.
It does NOT explain why the one that is least used, by a large majority, and likely was not used in those 3 cases either, hard to confirm, is the one titling his page.

Even his 3 earliest credits on IMDb list "as Dmitri Hvorostovsky".


2 of the 3 without the "as D...H..." are from Russian TV - awards shows, where, if his name was shown onscreen, it was likely only in the Russian alphabet:


And the 3rd is just laziness, because it's a second (soundtrack) credit for an opera where he appears onscreen and is credited as such on IMDb.
The proper credit:
Actor: TV (5 credits)
The Metropolitan Opera HD Live (TV Series) 
Count Di Luna / Count Anckarström (Renato) / Giorgio Germont / ...
...
- Tchaikovsky's Eugene Onegin (2007) ... Eugene Onegin (as Dmitri Hvorostovsky)
and (with spelling error "Onegine" in the credit itself, which is a pointless entry since no "songs" are listed):
Soundtrack: TV (1 credit)
 2007 The Metropolitan Opera HD Live (TV Series) (performer - 1 episode) 
- Tchaikovsky's Eugene Onegin (2007) ... (performer: "Eugene Onegine")
I would try to contribute a name change, but that is the sort of thing IMDb resists. So I thought I'd start here, and hope to get an official response.



(Edited)
Photo of MAthePA

MAthePA

  • 1928 Posts
  • 3297 Reply Likes
"2 of the 3 are from Russian TV - awards shows, where, if his name was shown onscreen, it was likely only in the Russian alphabet"

Those for sure might be transliterated as "Khvorostovskiy" according to IMDb rules.
Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes
And then those can be listed with the "as D... K..." if the rules prevent his Anglicized name from being used, and the 24 others would have the their "as D... H..." removed. Or, if Dmitri Hvorostovsky is also an accepted translation by IMDb rules, then he could have all his credits with no "as..." attributes.

It just looks ridiculous that nearly every credit has the same "correction" to the IMDb choice for titling the page. Perhaps it was a valid choice when the page was first created, but not with his body of credits now.
Photo of MAthePA

MAthePA

  • 1928 Posts
  • 3297 Reply Likes
bderoes, the "Klingon" mentioned above is not correct. That was my blind quote of other person's wider explanation on my words. I should cite myself on this matter:
IMDb has their own rules for transliteration from cyrillic, and such rules are the same as in Google translator.

To check this, "Хворостовский" (Khvorostovskiy) is a very good example.
(Edited)
Photo of Will

Will, Official Rep

  • 3691 Posts
  • 4565 Reply Likes
Hi bderoes, 

Given the above I think that this is a valid case for a primary name change, have you tried submitting it yet? If not can you do so and let me know if you encounter any issues?

Regards,
Will
Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes
Thanks, Will.
Just now submitted on Contribution #190528-143056-337000

Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes
Will,
While submitting the name change, this Name was raised as a possible match:
https://www.imdb.com/name/nm10487611/
Dmitry Hvorotovsky
with sole credit
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9805806/
The Man Who Changed the World. Mikhail Gorbachev's 80th Birthday Gala (2011)

Notice this differs from Dmitri Hvorostovsky in both 1st and last name (missing s), but I'm certain this credit belongs to the opera singer whose name we are changing, especially given all the pre-event press coverage I find (see below). But that doesn't help with onscreen credit, especially not how it was spelled.

Clearly this name should be merged into Dmitri Hvorostovsky once that change goes through; what advice do you have for "preserving the credit" on this title? Could've been wrong onscreen; could've been the contributor who transcribed it badly. Is there evidence in your archives for this spelling on this title?


Pre-event press coverage; in each of these, the emphasis is mine:
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/the-mikhail-gorbachev-award---the-man-who-changed-the-world-117170668.html
...
    - Stars from East and West will unite to perform on stage. Acts include:
      The London Symphony Orchestra and Valeriy Gergiev, Paul Anka, Brian
      Ferry, Dmitri Hvorostovsky, Dame Shirley Bassey, Katherine Jenkins,
      Melanie C, "The Scorpions", Andrey Gavrilov, Lara Fabian, Andrey
      Makarevich and "Machina Vremeni", Mila Jovovich and Igor Krutoy.

Also:
http://www.gorby.ru/en/presscenter/publication/show_28348/
...
Among the stars who will perform at this gala are Bryan Ferry, Paul Anka, Katherine Jenkins, Shirley Bassey, Lara Fabian, Melanie C, the Scorpions, London Symphony Orchestra and Valery Gergiev, leading dancers from Bolshoi Ballet and Mariinsky Opera and Ballet, Igor Krutoi, Andrey Makarevich and "Mashina Vremeni, " Dmitri Hvorostovsky-and this are only some of the names.

And:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1371656/Mikhail-Gorbachevs-80th-birthday-Sharon-Stone-Goldie-Hawn-Katherine-Jenkins.html
...
A host of Russian musicians were also expected to perform, including baritone Dmitry Hvorostovsky, rock stars Andrey Makarevich and Mashina Vremeni and the Turetsky Choir, a choir founded by conductor Michael Turetsky from the Moscow Central Synagogue.

And:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/8348146/What-a-night-Sharon-Stone-Sporty-Spice-and-Gorby....html
...
Into this bizarre mix are thrown the London Symphony Orchestra, the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra and Dmitri Hvorostovsky, a leading baritone opera singer. 


Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes
The primary name change is implemented, and, although I foolishly did not keep a copy of the original, all the credits now look sensible. Nicely done!

Now I've submitted a merge of the single-credit Name mentioned immediately above, and kept the "preserve credits" checked. I don't have enough justification to claim the onscreen credit is NOT misspelled, although I'd bet a few bucks that it's not.
Contribution #190531-145306-591000
Photo of MAthePA

MAthePA

  • 1928 Posts
  • 3297 Reply Likes
Congrats, bderoes.
Mostly all credits seem to be OK now. 
Still, the two below don't follow the transliteration rules:
Rossiyskaya natsionalnaya muzykalnaya premiya 2015 (TV Special)
Vecherniy Urgant (TV Series) - Episode #2.66 (2012) ... Himself
Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes
I don't know anything about that. If you think these credits need attributes, then submit a Contribution. But you're (very reasonably) assuming that his name was not also displayed as Dmitri Hvorostovsky, perhaps in an English-subtitled edition. Unless you have access to these titles.

I must add: I believe those 2 titles had the "(as Dmitri Hvorostovsky)" attribute before the name correction (trusting my multiple checks of the counts of how many had/didn't have the attribute when posting and replying to this thread.)
(Edited)
Photo of MAthePA

MAthePA

  • 1928 Posts
  • 3297 Reply Likes
I used the same logic of yours:
...are from Russian TV - awards shows, where, if his name was shown onscreen, it was likely only in the Russian alphabet
that was initially demonstrated above, and may be and actually is checked against the production companies, the countries of production, the other performers credited, and other data in the base for both titles mentioned above.

PS: I'm not saying those change is initiated by you. They might be initially submitted as "Dmitri Hvorostovsky" by other contributors.
(Edited)
Photo of bderoes

bderoes, Champion

  • 1201 Posts
  • 1772 Reply Likes
MAthePA,
Look, I did not submit a change to each credit. I submitted a change to the Name only, and IMDb decided how to handle each credit.

IMDb (not I) introduced the new (as...) attribute of the old spelling on the 2 Russian TV shows that formerly did NOT have the (as...) attribute of the most-used spelling. They preserved past data that they had no reason to change. 

The problem that I saw is now fixed. You are seeing other problems. So either submit an edit or don't. It's up to IMDb to decide the merits.

BTW, "Dmitri Hvorostovsky" is not the original name of the page that started this thread. It's the name of a SECOND page for which I've submitted (today) a merge.
(Edited)