Question about Listing Stunt Credits on the site.

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  • Updated 4 years ago
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This topic mostly is in regards to stunt credits on television.

Why do data editors add (uncredited) next to the credit on the website before the episode airs?

How would they know if a certain credit will be listed on-screen or not until after it airs?

Specifically, I'm referring to the show Angie Tribeca. This is a new series. No episodes have aired yet. Why do your data editors assume that I will be uncredited? Wouldn't it make more sense to give the benefit of the doubt, then fix it later? Especially since tons of other stunt players on the same show are listed on IMDb and they don't have the uncredited attribute next to their names. 

Secondly, if there are rules about how a credit should be listed on the site, either with the uncredited attribute or without it, how come those rules are not strictly enforced?

Case in point: if you look at many of the shows that I've worked on that have the uncredited attribute listed next to them on the IMDb page corresponding to my name, why is it that so many other stunt players don't have the uncredited attribute next to their names for working on the same show?
IE: Scandal, Majors Crimes, etc, etc.
(TV credits are pretty uniform, they either list stunts or they don't, but rarely do they list some stunt players and not others.) 

If you make the argument that TV credits don't usually list stuntmen and stuntwoman, they why do you only add the uncredited attribute next to some of the stunt players (like me) and not for all the others?

All that I am saying is that if you aren't going to put the uncredited attribute next to everyone that's uncredited, then shouldn't you either change the rules of the site, or at least keep it uniform and not add the attribute to anyone at all?

Of course, there might be many countering reasons for IMDb's position on this that I have not thought of, so that's why I kindly bring it to your attention and hopefully get a response.

Thanks and have a great day!


PS: (added this to the original message above at 1:08 PM PST)

Another reason why I think this is important to note is that if someone were to click and browse the Series Full Cast & Crew link for any television show, no uncredited stunt work will appear.
Here is an example:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1936532/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast

You won't see my name listed here, yet I've worked more episodes of this show than most of the other stunt players names that do come up on this list, but because I'm listed as uncredited, I don't appear on this section of the website.

It's not right that someone who worked one day on a show appears in the full cast and crew credits, when someone else who has been a semi-regular doesn't appear on this section of the website because data editors add uncredited next to one person and not to the other when both were actually uncredited.
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steve

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Posted 4 years ago

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Michelle, Official Rep

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Hi Steve -

1) When an 'uncredited' attribute is listed, this generally means that an individual worked on the title but their name was not credited within the on-screen credit roll for that film/show.

For episode titles, since the on-screen credits for episodes are often limited to select staff and credits for unreleased titles are often hard to verify and subject to change, they are added at our editors' discretion. I can assure you that our staff always applies content policies fairly, consistently and uniformly, on the basis of the data that is presented in front of them, and that they look forward to the chance of rectifying any error or omission that may have been made.

Concerning "Angie Tribeca", if you are listed with the attribute but are certain you will be credited on-screen, you can submit the applicable credit corrections (requesting the removal of the attribute), however, if the update is not accepted, this means that you will need to wait for the episode to be released.

2) While we do have some Help pages about "uncredited" entries, for example:

http://www.imdb.com/help/search?domain=helpdesk_faq&index=1&file=uncredited&ref_=hlp_sr_...
http://www.imdb.com/help/search?domain=helpdesk_faq&index=1&file=uncreditedcredits&ref_=...
http://www.imdb.com/help/search?domain=helpdesk_faq&index=2&file=cast&ref_=hlp_sr_2#uncr...

We can do better about making our policies and processes more accessible on the site, which our staff are currently working on.

With regard to the inconsistencies you pointed out (about why some crew members are listed with the attribute and others are not), please remember that credits for unreleased titles are accepted and evaluated by our editors on a case-by-case basis, and the decision to accept them is made after considering a number of different factors
(including, but not limited to, past submissions/credits for the same person, and whether that person received on-screen billing in similar productions made or released around the same time).  We are not perfect, so errors are always possible, and when they are brought to our attention, we strive to address them, especially when we are presented with actionable information.

If you are aware of  listings/credits for the same title that were accepted prematurely or incorrectly (e.g. you know that the person does not or will not receive on-screen billing but is not currently listed with the 'uncredited' attribute) please submit an update to correct this and our staff will be happy to review and make all appropriate changes.
(Edited)
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steve

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Thank you for the thorough reply. How other people's credits appear within the database (credited or uncredited) is not my business, so I don't want to mess with that. I'm not employed by IMDb and how one's IMDb page appears can affect his or her career and livelihood. 

I did however give you one example of an entire series that is completely incorrect when it comes to listed people with credits. Almost all tv series on the site are the same -- incorrect. (allowing most people to get away with not having the uncredited attribute in this specific department)

My main concern here is what is fair -- it should be the same for everyone. If almost everyone is listed with a credit in the database, even though it's not on-screen, then all performers should be treated equally.



As a result of the uncredited attribute, credits do not appear on the series full cast and crew list.
This is why this should be rectified. Consider if I were to work a full season on a show, never be credited, and then a day player works one day, and doesn't have the attribute added next to his credit on the database, one would never know that I was a regular on the show, but would be aware that some other person who day played did in fact work on it.


I hope the editors can understand my point of view. I hope the IMDb team also understand this as well.

Thanks again for the reply.

Steve
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DavidAH_Ca, Champion

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IMDb was created originally to record on-screen credits accurately, and even though it has expanded a lot, this is still one of its primary purposes.

IMDb was started by fans and it was they who submitted all the data to begin with, and because they had no personal stake in the filmographies they tended to enter accurate data (aside from human error). Much of the decision on whether or not to accept credits was a matter of trust. Once it became well-known data was added by producers and the people named in the credits; they sometimes ignored (or did not bother to learn) the regulations in order to put the best face on their pages.

I am not staff, so I cannot give a definitive answer, but I will say how it appears to me.

I have only seen complaints about submissions being changed to (uncredited) recently, so I believe that IMDb is changing its policy on trust; where they used to accept a basic credit and add the attribute if the person was not listed in the credits when the Title was released. Of course, the person who had added the credit usually did not return to update the listing in this case (possibly because they did not understand exactly what (uncredited) means). My feeling is that they have decided that it is better to add the attribute (unless the submitter is a major contributor) because the person will almost certainly return to correct it if they are actually credited on screen.

This might explain why older credits are listed without the attribute, but yours was changed.

As a side note: when Contributors audit credits and find an IMDb listing that does not appear on screen, they often submit a Delete for it, rather than adding an attribute. The reasoning is that they know the item is incorrect as listed, but have no evidence that the person worked on the Title. If they  submit a change to add (uncredited), they are saying they know the person worked on the project, which is false. Moreover, once the item is listed as (uncredited) no other contributor will have the knowledge to remove it if it actually is false, and the person involved is unlikely to return and remove the credit if it actually is false. However, if the credit is removed, the person will likely complain, and then will need to submit the corrected credit with evidence it is correct.

Therefore it is probably better to have an incorrect (uncredited) attribute until the Title is released rather than to incorrectly have a listing that needs it but doesn't have it.
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steve

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ThIs a great explanation. Thank you. I agree with everything you said. However, there is still a problem with uncredited credits not appearing in tv series full cast and crew section.