Keywords scenes, scene and one-scene

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  • Updated 3 weeks ago
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Can a staffer please delete the keywords scene (https://www.imdb.com/search/keyword/?keywords=scene) and scenes (https://www.imdb.com/search/keyword/?keywords=scenes) and block them? Keywords in plural aren't allowed, which would mean 'scenes' should be merged into 'scene'. But because literally every title has a scene in it, this keyword doesn't serve any purpose.

Also, I feel the keyword one-scene (https://www.imdb.com/search/keyword/?keywords=one-scene) should be merged into the keyword consisting-entirely-of-one-scene (https://www.imdb.com/search/keyword/?keywords=consisting-entirely-of-one-scene). Can a staffer do this please and re-route any instances of one-scene in the future?




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Marco

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Posted 4 weeks ago

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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Marco???
What if the movie is about someone who is making a movie. And the word "scene' is important to the plot as a keyword? Or in a looser sense, the description "she was so drunk she created a 'scene' in the restaurant" (US Slang) for a problem.
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Marco

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Ed???
I'd say shooting-a-scene would be much better and more specific for someone who's making a movie.
If someone is creating or making a scene, the keyword making-a-scene (https://www.imdb.com/search/keyword/?keywords=making-a-scene) could be used.
This being said, I feel the fact that you and I already have three different possible interpretations of the current keywords 'scene', 'scenes' and 'one-scene' goes to show they aren't very good keywords.

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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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This says it all.





Between what Nikolay and I said, Will concluded that you have your answer, hence it is marked as answered. The keywords will not be deleted. I'm not arguing with you.
Nikolay's and my observations are the reason Will made the decision to mark this as answered.
Any further diatribe will not change the fact that Will agrees that those keywords shall remain.

Thanks
:):)
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Adrian, Champion

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The problem, Ed, is that does not say it all. The other answers were not here at that time and really, there should be an official explanation on why generic terms that have multiple meanings should be keywords. Even if you think most keywords are useless, these are less than useless as they would give you a bunch of unrelated subjects.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Eliminating keywords does not fix the problem.
Eliminating keywords that do not belong on a title is the key to fixing keywords.
Proper use.
Is the "Keyword" key to the plot? Or was it added as it is part of a plot, but not "Key" to a plot.
Keywords are haphazardly attached.
Fix that root problem.
Removing and or combining keywords as a means to "What" end is vague.
Fix the root problem. Misapplication.
(Edited)
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Marco

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Any further diatribe will not change the fact that Will agrees that those keywords shall remain.

The interesting thing of this is that I can't reply to a post of Will to ask him why he feels these pointless keywords should stick around but theoretically I could be tempted to argue with you about it, which wouldn't really help both of us (or the database) and would lead to an atmosphere IMDb has forbidden around here. So once again, IMDb's failure to communicate has reared its ugly head... The move from the message boards on www.imdb.com to these boards of GetSat didn't do anything for contributors it seems.
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Marco

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Eliminating keywords does not fix the problem.

Are you saying useless and/or wrong keywords (I don't mean 'scene' or 'scenes', but in general) should not be eliminated? Are you saying the database wouldn't be a tad better if they were eliminated?
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Not Pointless.
Does not have to explain why. (Will)
Removal of Message Boards was necessary. Civility was deteriorating. Policing it was impossible.
Full keywords and their variations is a good thing. Reducing them is a Bad Thing.
Misuse, overuse, and misapplication is not just bad, but at this time Monumentally Bad.
This would not even be an issue if Keywords were properly used.
Elimination does not fix the problem with Keywords.
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Marco

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Well, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree about these keywords being pointless or not. You are of course right, you are not obliged to explain why you feel they aren't pointless, but you not having to explain this doesn't have anything to do with how Will or IMDb feels about these keywords.

I agree the removal of the message boards was necessary, I stated before on GetSat that I am aware of this. However, it was said by IMDb that GetSat would also lead to better communication between staff and contributors. This has not been my experience at all I'm afraid.

Obviously, elimination doesn't fix the whole problem regarding keywords, but it does help a little bit if pointless keywords get deleted or merged into proper keywords.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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You are of course right, you are not obliged to explain why you feel they aren't pointless
Hey, I was referring to Will. Not me. He need not justify or explain anything to any of us. He is going by an unalterable set of rules. To explain every little concern or question by repeating what another contributor has already stated is counter productive. While you might not like the result. accept it and move forward.
Nikolay and I provided an obvious answer that he agreed with. End of story. He disagreed that any of your suggestions needed to be applied. It's as simple as that.
Do you really have a need to be told the same thing twice?
I'm sure you will agree that it is not necessary.
Nikolay and I made a reasonable hypothesis that turned out to be IMDb policy.
Will agreed. No Changes as suggested by you.
(Edited)
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Marco

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Nikolay and I made a reasonable hypothesis that turned out to be IMDb policy.

So plural keywords are okay now? I say this because 'scenes' is still around, even though Will gave a like to Nikolay, who stated that 'scenes' (as well as 'one-scene') should probably be merged and deleted. See, these likes aren't as helpful as you make them out to be.
And another question that goes unanswered: Are all ambiguous keywords allowed now? And how would that be in accordance with allowing "visitors to easily search and discover titles"? How is a keyword helpful if you can't know what it refers to? See, Will was fast on this thread with pushing two buttons and you were fast in stating there's nothing more to talk about because Will pushed two buttons, but a lot of questions still haven't been and - probably - won't be answered.
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Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

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Marco, they are eligible in some cases such as one of my favorite IMDb keywords: unexplained-events. One might argue that it might be changed to unexplained-event, but we have a lot of titles in which there are multiple unexplained events. 
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Marco

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One might argue that it might be changed to unexplained-event, but we have a lot of titles in which there are multiple unexplained events.

There are also quite a lot of titles that feature multiple trains, but according to the guide " trains should be train"...
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Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

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Expanding on what Ed said I sat on this thought a lot and there ought to be some use for keyword "scene". Especially since it is also an architectural term. It's a loose keyword, but I can imagine several uses for it. And I totally forgot about that (a busy month can do it, I guess) but I used that very keyword myself this very month: "Notes on the Scene" (2017) was added by me.  

As for "one-scene" and "scenes" these should probably be merged and deleted. 
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I'm thinking it should be more descriptive than "scene" as that really doesn't tell me much as there are several uses for it. For example, Ed's case above should be "causing-a-scene". I haven't seen "Notes on the Scene" so I can't comment. I mostly agree with Marco that it is too generic of a term to really be useful.
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Marco

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I can imagine several uses for it.

So how can a user of the site know which meaning is meant by the keyword? And if a user doesn't know which meaning is meant, how is the keyword useful?
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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And to all that reads this. My feeling is that keywords are nearly useless as a whole. I feel that 80% of them are misapplied.
I will not reply any further on this either.
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Marco

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My feeling is that keywords are nearly useless as a whole. I feel that 80% of them are misapplied.

Do you think your responses have helped get things slightly more to a percentage of 79% misapplied or perhaps to 81% misapplied? Or don't you care about keywords at all but nevertheless felt the need to talk about them?