More fake stunt credits

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I don't really understand why the people at IMDb doesn't step in. A few days ago I was able to get a small portion of these fake stunt credits off some of these western people but the contributor is still adding more daily. I'm sure he means well but I had Jack Tornek all cleared up and now he's got 2 brand new (Kansas Raiders) and Adventures of Red Ryder. 

Whomever is doing this has basically put thousands of fake credits on what are cowboy extras under SAG and SEG terms. The cowboy extras were certified by SAG for their ability to ride horses, do posse scenes, ect. 

Now I see Ralph Bucko, Bob Reeves, Frank MIlls. Jack Montgomery, and Roy Bucko have a ton of fake stunt credits. All of which were cowboy extras. 

Here's the issue once in a blue moon some of them would be called on to do stunts but not that often. They made a living being cowboy extras and would ride horses (which even SAG says isn't a stuntman) and it seems somebody now sees their name on a cast list and puts them down for stunts. 

I'm actually afraid to put some stunt credits on people now because I don't want whomever is doing this to start listing them as stuntmen in all of the productions they were working extra in.

Can a staff member please put a stop to whomever is doing this and take out what is probably by now thousands of fake credits he has submitted.
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Phillip Arnold

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Posted 7 months ago

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Joel, Official Rep

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Hi Phillip, 

Thanks for your post and bringing this to our attention. 

Could you please provide us with URL's and examples of these ineligible credits and we can review this further for you. 

We look forward to your response.

Joel 
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Phillip Arnold

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No problem,


Here's a great example. Slim Gaut.  Gaut had I think 1 stunt credit on his IMDb but he was a member of the screen extras guild. Gaunt once in a blue moon doubled somebody but a majority of his work was SEG and bits. He appears in a lot of bigger budget westerns primarily as an extra. I even have a contract which he list himself down as a SEG member.

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0310215/?ref_=nv_sr_1?ref_=nv_sr_1#stunts


Kansas Raiders was another recent add.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0042629/reference


Tex Holden who I tried to clean up before only had one leg. He was given one or two stunt credits because he knew powerful people but it was nothing more then charity but whomever is doing this thinks he's a stuntman now and puts him down for stunts in whatever they watch.


Heres a perfect example. The Maverick episode "Holiday at Hallow Rock" I put down some people who were working extra at the time (Fred Carson, Kermit Maynard, Bob Reeves) and now whomever is doing this put them down for stunts for the episode. Carson collected random paychecks at Warner Brothers doing this and Maynard and Reeves were old past their prime cowboys who were reduced to appearing in Warner Brothers productions filling bar scenes. Reeves even died at the unemployment office. I watched the episode and they just weren't stuntman. Warner Brothers was so cheap that their stars had to sue them to get a raise and they constantly used stock footage of action sequences so the thought of them paying people stunt money beyond one or two guilded stuntmen is actually laughable. 

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0644457/reference



Ralph Bucko and his brother Roy were Riding extras, not stuntmen. They did henchman work.

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0118769/?ref_=nv_sr_1?ref_=nv_sr_1#stunts

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0118771/?ref_=nv_sr_1?ref_=nv_sr_1

Frank Mills is one of your go-to Derelicts who had I think 1 stunt credit. He was 200 pounds and regularly had dialog but could appear in many skid-row scenes as an extra.

https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0587117/?ref_=nv_sr_2?ref_=nv_sr_2#stunts


It seems whomever is doing this is watching a lot of the western channel and they see what's on television and see names on cast and then they just put them down for stunts. Kansas Raiders was just on television two weeks ago. I had to clean up Frenchie (1950) and that was on television at the same time. 

You can tell they are fake because they never add any additional names that aren't already listed in the cast list and there are probably many undocumented names that did stunts but there's just no way of knowing. I'm sure if you asked this person for proof on all of these credits their give you some dumb answer like "They are stuntmen so must have done stunts for the production when in reality most of them had a stunt double upgrade here and there but the reality is that majority of their work were just collecting paychecks as extras and whomever is doing this literally has muddied probably a hundred or more people's profiles with fictitious stunt credits. 

You can check Mills, Holden, Gaut, and some other's histories and see I added a ton of the acting credits so I'm not speaking about people I know nothing about.

Best Wishes

Phil

















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Phillip Arnold

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Now whomever is vandalizing them just put some credits on Gun for a Coward (1956) including another stunt credit for John Barton who has 1 leg and could hardly walk. As I mentioned, his "stunt" credit was only because they needed a peg-leg guy to walk for an actor playing a peg leg character. 

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0049285/reference
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Nikolay Yeriomin (Mykola Yeromin), Champion

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Phillip Arnold, I really wonder what goes in this vandal's head. It's wither one thinks he's very clever for "discovering" the double without checking for proofs properly or... I don't know, even. In some cases you can see actor or stuntman doing a stunt, it's provable going frame-by-frame as with Eric Stoltz in Back to the Future (1985) (after he was recast as Marty they left a few shots of him one of which is driving at a high speed) or John Landis in An American Werewolf in London (1981) (btw, his western stunt listings are very much legit: he worked as a stuntman and extra in Italy for several years). There are also interviews which confirm things like that... For some reason I believe person never even tried anything of that, just adding people on a hunch. 
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Michelle, Official Rep

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Hi Phil -

Thanks for the additional information, our staff did previously reach-out to the contributor regarding these credits (as well as others that were reported) and they confirmed that the stunt credits were being added based on the person's name being referenced in call sheets, production pay slips, etc.

If you are certain that there are instances where the individual didn't perform a stunt role, please continue to request the removal of these credits, if yo would like our staff to investigate further, please then post those submission reference numbers here and we can delve into the issue further.
(Edited)