Problem with Howard Hughes (I) Page

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  • Updated 4 weeks ago
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  • (Edited)
Some one has attached Hughes (nm0400652) as a misc crew credit as a presenter to all of his Movies and then some, on titles Produced by Batjac Productions (John Wayne) and others. There are approximately 24,000 misc crew entries for "presenter". This is such a vague reference that it in my opinion needs a review as a job description.
The 24 submissions  #190318-044556-394000
were made and declined for removal as "we were unable to accept your submission as we were unable to verify the information provided".

The information could not have been verified when it was added, let alone for my deletion submission!

Also it is in reality another way of saying Producer (presenter).
Speaking of Producer credits by the way, 2 are actual and the other 24 are uncredited. I would venture that they are questionable as well.



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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Posted 1 month ago

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Peter, Champion

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The films may have the credit "Howard Hughes presents" or "Presented by Howard Hughes".

Producers guide:
A note on "presented by": For films produced under the studio system, such credits often indicated the head of the studio and nothing more. They might, in some cases, be somewhat analogous to a modern Executive Producer credit, but should not be translated into such; they should be added to the miscellaneous crew section as "presenter".
https://help.imdb.com/article/contrib...
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MAthePA

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This is how the 20th Century Fox started:
[opening titles in the original order]




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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Reprint:
A note on "presented by": For films produced under the studio system, such credits often indicated the head of the studio and nothing more. They might, in some cases, be somewhat analogous to a modern Executive Producer credit, but should not be translated into such; they should be added to the miscellaneous crew section as "presenter".
Then he Qualifies how?
These are not in the studio system.
The other titles have an executive producer.
He is already credited as Producer (uncredited) on all the same titles!?!?
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0050562/fullcredits?ref_=tt_cl_sm#cast

Produced by 
Jules Furthman ... producer
Howard Hughes
... producer (uncredited)

Other crew 
Howard Hughes ... presenter
J.S. Nash
... project pilot (as Captain J.S. Nash)
Clarence A. Shoop
... assistant to producer (as Brig. Gen. Clarence A. Shoop)
Philip G. Cochran
... technical advisor (uncredited)
Evelyn Earle
... script supervisor (uncredited)
Paul Mantz
... pilot (uncredited)
Stan Margulies
... publicist (uncredited)
Dixie McCoy
... dialogue director (uncredited)
Sidney Zipser ... Technicolor technician (uncredited)



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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Many duplicates of already accepted accreditation.


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Will, Official Rep

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Hi Ed,

It seems like the credits for Howard Hughes are eligible and correctly placed into the miscellaneous crew department if he is credited in this way on screen. The "presentor" moniker can indicate a different level of involvement in the production, depending on the case and individual in question. If other users have researched his work on those titles and concluded that he did complete the work of a producer on the title then the additional (uncredited) producer credit may well be valid on the title.

I hope this helps.

Regards,
Will
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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It just seems odd that he is credited twice for the same basic job.
And I can recall no Presenter in any movie billing.
"Presented by" Howard Hughes or
Howard Hughes "Presents".
Yes.


Seems that "policy" incorrectly reflects what is seen on screen.
Just a thought!
Cheers
and Thanks, Will
(Edited)
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Will, Official Rep

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Hi Ed,

If you can confirm from having watched the title that he wasn't credited under that moniker on screen then you can submit a delete against the credit and our data editors will be happy to take a look.

Regards,
Will
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Will, the submission number above was already submitted.
Again, If he is credited as an uncredited producer, than why the need to be credited twice for the same thing.
His Credit for 1955's Son of Sinbad.

Seems that "policy" incorrectly reflects what is seen on screen.
I Submitted the deletions knowing full well that none of his titles say presenter.
They should reflect what is seen in the screenshot below.
That's why I did not submit corrections as I cannot verify precisely what style each title used. The majority however are as is seen below.

It is the IMDb's policy to rename them for the sake of uniformity.
It makes the database inaccurate.
they should be added to the miscellaneous crew section as "presenter".



(Edited)
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Michelle, Official Rep

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Hi Ed -

Thanks for posting the screen grab, since Mr. Hughes was credited with a "Presents" credit, the Miscellaneous Crew presents credit is valid and will need to remain listed.

It's my understanding that "presents" can represent different things, which is why if an individual performed the role as Producer on a film we would also want to retain that information.  For instance, if Mr. Hughes had been credited on-screen as Producer for this title, we would still list the producer credit in addition to the presenter credit.

I will pass along your feedback to our editors and if they have additional policy information regarding these credits I will share that with you here.
(Edited)
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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When a title is listed in that fashion, which most titles were then in that era, the producer credit is now deleted?????? No where is Hughes in the billing as a "Producer". So as a policy of "?" you have removed him as the producer from IMDb's credits based on "Policy"? He is most definitely the Exec Producer, but because he is not credited on screen as such, by IMDb definition, he can only receive a credit in Misc. Crew? I sure hope you revisit this whole policy and come to a better solution than what is in use at this time.

And thanks for your time on this. It is not a life or death matter for me. LOL
Just would like to help make the database I have used for so many years a better and more accurate place for info. It is always better to be clear and accurate. No one can fault you for being correct.

Cheers.

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Adrian, Champion

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What you are actually saying is that the uncredited producer credit should be removed as it, most likely, violates IMDb crediting standards for producers.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Presenter, Producer.
Tomato, Tomahto.
He is basically getting double credit.
If they insist in calling the screenshot above the "presenter" which equals Exec Producer and have said above that it is "the" definitive credit, then the lack of the word in the billing of "producer" should disqualify him as an uncredited, because he "is" credited as presenter.
Did that make sense to you?
Michelle asked that I submit a deletion as Producer uncredited.
Which I won't do either.
Wan't badly to see the decision before proceeding.
Cheers, Adrian.
(Edited)
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Peter, Champion

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Michelle didn't ask you to submit anything, nor did she say the producer credit could not be listed.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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It was Will
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Peter, Champion

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He didn't say the producer credits could not be listed either.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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And neither have I
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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Repeating myself again
It was Will
(Edited)
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Peter, Champion

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I was referring to your post which starts "When a title is listed in that fashion, which most titles were then in that era, the producer credit is now deleted??????"

They didn't say anywhere that the producer credits would be deleted.
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Ed Jones (XLIX)

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The post progressed if you read it all. Will, Michell, and I were beyond that point and on to other points.
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Joel, Employee

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As mentioned previously, in circumstances where the original contributor is confident a person had active involvement when it comes to producing a title - it can be acceptable in those cases to provide an (uncredited) listing for that role.

However, if you are confident this role wasn't performed on the titles, please feel free to submit a deletion request with additional evidence supporting this and one of our editors can review this further for you.

Joel