Top listeners bug.

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  • Problem
  • Updated 12 months ago
  • Solved
  • (Edited)
Today I noticed that I'm not on the list of top listeners. In less than 24 hours I vanished on all artists pages. What's going on here?

Those are the only bands that I can remember of right now.

Slayer, Ratt, Type o Negative, Kenny Rogers, Zar, Five Finger Death Punch, Testament, Overkill, Triumph, Grand Prix, Icon, Solitude Aeturnus, Pentagram, Accept, Dokken, Living in a Box, Death Angel, and Autograph.
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Patrick

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Posted 3 years ago

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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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If I remember correctly, it takes time into account (it's not the overall top listeners, it's recent top listeners), so the fact that you haven't played these artists much in the last 3 months is the likely cause:

e.g.
https://www.last.fm/user/Samson-91/library/music/Slayer?date_preset=LAST_90_DAYS
https://www.last.fm/user/Samson-91/library/music/Ratt?date_preset=LAST_90_DAYS
https://www.last.fm/user/Samson-91/library/music/Type+O+Negative?date_preset=LAST_90_DAYS
https://www.last.fm/user/Samson-91/library/music/SOLITUDE?date_preset=LAST_90_DAYS

I'm trying to get confirmation.

(Edited)
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Patrick

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So, I guess I'll have to keep them up to do date. That explains everything. As of that last URL, I'm not listening to pop band solitude. This the artist I'm referring to https://www.last.fm/user/Samson-91/library/music/Solitude+Aeturnus?date_preset=LAST_90_DAYS 
For Solitude Aeturnus I have almost 500 scrobbles.

Also, how do you explain this? https://www.last.fm/user/Enigma_Machine_/library/music/Cannibal+Corpse/_/The+Undead+Will+Feast

Enigma_Machine_ didn't scrobble this track during the selected date range (90 days). Try expanding the date range or view scrobbles for all time.
He's a top listener without problems.
(Edited)
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Magdalena

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Is there anybody who cares about this site anymore? I got the same issue. I have this one band I listen nearly everyday, and I am not even on 'Top Listeners' though I used to be in the first four, now I'm not at all. What's going on? First scrobbler doesn't want to work, now I vanished from the listeners... Why have changed the site and then left it even worse? I don't get it...
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Andreas_Wotte

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The Top Listener tool still seems not to work correctly. 24 hours after the last scrobble I can't find my name on the ranking list:
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Andreas_Wotte

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Next day, more top listener, unfortunately without me. The least number of a top listeners scrobbels was 3 (!!!) (on the other hand 38 scrobbels on my account). So, what's up with this tool?
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Hmm, that's odd.  I can see that this user is listed, but you aren't: https://www.last.fm/user/matboes/library/music/Severija?date_preset=ALL  

I'll ask if someone can look into it. 
(Edited)
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Andreas_Wotte

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"... it's recent top listeners ..."
I'd proofed that one more time Jon and the feature doesn't work, or doesn't work in this way. Here an example:
The guitarist Tomatito has a top listener on the last place with the user name hal9k. He scrobbled the quoted song 8 times overall, the artist in 2017 2times and overall 124 times. Like you can see, I scrobbled - until writing this comment - the most listened track 24 times, the artist in 2017 115 times and overall 545 times. And there is a long list of artists, I should be a top listener, but I'm not on the list. So it's proofed: The top listener tool doesn't do what it was made for.
Jon, can you please the developement team to repair that, please?
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Are there any artists you're shown as being a top listener of?
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Andreas_Wotte

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Good question. Just I thought yes. But after the check, I have to say no. :-( A few weeks ago, you found me here.
Maybe a question of listening history. I will scrobble the artist a few times immediately.
(Edited)
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Andreas_Wotte

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I've checked some more artist, whose list I am missing. For example Vicente Amigo, John Scofield, Dagobert Böhm, TaxiWars, Idris Elba or Yelli Yelli. E.g. Yelli Yelli has 958 listener with 5067 scrobbles and 114 top listener with 7 scrobbles at least. I've scrobbled the band this year 135 times.
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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I've asked Sachin to look into it for you.  The service is definitely running and working as I'm a top listener of this artist, which I only discovered last week, so I think it might be an account specific problem.
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Andreas_Wotte

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Thank you for forwarding Jon. This summer I've seen my avatar in some top listener lists, today I saw some of my LFM friends are top listeners too. Something was happening since summer I guess. I hope, Sachin can solve the problem. So I'm looking forward to his or your feedback. See you :-)
(Edited)
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Magdalena

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So, does it work? Because I'm still not even on the list of listeners, though I've listened to the band so much. 

https://www.last.fm/music/Faunts/+listeners

I've been listening to these guys for years. Am not even on the list of listeners... how is that possible?

Nearly 15,000 scrobbles. And I just magically disappeard from the listeners, I checked all the pages. I just vanished.

https://www.last.fm/user/magda-333

I would appreciate it if somebody could just explain or fix this case, please.
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Andreas_Wotte

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No Magda, nothing has changed. The top listener tool still isn't working. Perhaps we have to ask again.
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Hi Magdalena, I've added your example to the bug ticket to investigate.  Please be patient though, as we're a bit preoccupied with the catalogue generation not working as it should (might be related?).
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Andreas_Wotte

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Any news from the top listener bug?
Currently I'm the top listener of Rob Mirante but - like before - not on the list.
Is there a chance to repair this in 2017? After all Patrick pointed out this bug 8 month ago.
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Please be patient.  It's in our bug tracking software, and will be prioritised and picked up in due course.

Just to make sure nothing has changed now that the catalogue importer is running again, you're still not marked as a top listener for ANY artist that you know of, is that correct?  

Where you think you should definitely be a top listener (e.g. a more obscure artist), can you please post a comparison of your last 3 months scrobbles for the artist with the last "Top listener" on the very last page?  

>>>Is there a chance to repair this in 2017?

It's possible, but I don't think so. There's only one sprint left before Christmas after the current one finishes next Wednesday, and this bug is not well understood, hasn't been reproduced, and only affects 2 people. It will be discussed on Friday afternoon, so I should know then if it'll be entered into the next sprint or not.

>>>After all Patrick pointed out this bug 8 month ago.

If I remember correctly, Patrick's case was because he hadn't listened to the artist enough in the last 3 months to be listed, compared to others.  As far as we can tell, this is a new issue only affecting a small number of users -- probably shard specific.  We know it's definitely working for other people.

---
edit: I've been told it's 3 months, not 12.
(Edited)
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Andreas_Wotte

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"... you're still not marked as a top listener for ANY artist that you know of, is that correct? ..."
Yes, that's correct. I'm sure in case of all artists I've already quoted in this thread. But to solve the problem, I'll make a list.
... this is a new issue only affecting a small number of users ..."
With respect, but I doubt this: To discover this bug, you have seriously to search for your top listener position at a number of artists. I guess it's rather conceivable that the most didn't notice the bug. At least 2 people, Magda and me, noticed and posted it. After all, the follower of this support forum are only a small - and of course committed - part of the whole last.fm community.
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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>>>> I'm sure in case of all artists I've already quoted in this thread. But to solve the problem, I'll make a list.

Instead of doing that, maybe try scrobbling Test Artist a bit (say 5 scrobbles), and then check back in a week.  What I'm getting at here, is that if you're not a top listener for *anything*, even our test artist, that suggests that your account is being filtered out from these lists for some reason.
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Andreas_Wotte

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A good additional idea Jon. Please go to "Mobiles Jazzkommando" with 105 scrobbles. And guess what my scrobbles count. - Correct: 105 (now 108), 20 scrobbles in 2017. Once I've tagged it as "under 2 listener" and this circumstance is still true. ;-)
Like the top listener list says, there isn't a top listener. So the fact is easy to describe: My account isn't part of any top listener ranking.
2. example from the tag "Under 2 Listeners" ist the Duo "Heavy Classic". 1 listener, 50 scrobbles. And my scrobbles are - surprise, surprise - 50. Top Listener: 0 (that means Zero, not Oh ;-)
(btw. A complete tag list for all artists/albums/tracks would be welcome.)

https://www.last.fm/music/Mobiles+Jaz...
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Remember it's last 3 months.  


You only scrobbled the first artist 25 times yesterday, and the chart is updated weekly (I think), so we won't know until next week if it worked or not.  The second artist you haven't scrobbled in the last 90 days so won't be included in the top listener chart.
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Andreas_Wotte

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Thank you for the fast response. I will wait and make the list. But seemingly the tool doesn't work exactly this way. Like you can see Jon, as the only top listener Niggalex was listening the last time to "OtroPlano" more than 90 days ago. I was scrobbling the band 2 weeks ago and should be a top listener too.
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Andreas_Wotte

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Hi Jon!
Like promissed, on this friday afternoon I've made a list for my first 25 top artist of the last 90 days and compared the scrobbles with the last top listener of every artist: You see the artist plus my scrobbles and than the last top listener with his/her scrobbles:
01: Kings of Leon 239 times, the user Hiob3DR only 125 times. My number
02: Zaz 231 scrobbles. The user Dreamwinder 35. Than
03: Mark Knopfler with 193 and the userjurjenbugel 185
04: Santana - 170 scrobbles || user: Gringo2102 - 64 scrobbles
05: Banda Magda - 153 || user jazz-luca - 56
06: Jamie Cullum - 134 || Pantomime90 - 0 (=zero!)
07: Arno - 131 || Coudie -  1
08: Hindi Zahra - 130 || mowguette - 11
09: Ronny Jordan - 128 || hulkkar - 19
10: Vicente Amigo - 121 || degids - 1, overall - 72
11: Black Diamond Heavies - 120 || Roald - 10, overall - 10
12: Medeski Scofield Martin & Wood - 107 || SatchTheDog - 6, in 2017 - 13 scrobbles
13: The Rosenberg Trio - 104 || VUQuadrophenia - 0
14: Ibrahim Maalouf - too less scrobbles :-(
15: Grant Green - 96 || teledyn - 14
16: Marc Moulin - 95 || orsolino - 0, overall - 24
17: The Bahama Soul Club - 93 || Voxefx - 5, overall 45
18: John Scofield - 92 || brunsky2001 - 4
19: Avishai Cohen - too less scrobbles
20: B.B. King - 90 || barrechord - 57
21: Django Reinhardt - 84 || jjs89 - 2
22: Scarecrow Blues Hip Hop - 83 || mattam - 1, overall - 18
23: The Souljazz Orchestra - 81 || Deptford-Crew - 20, overall - 31
24: Daniel Melingo - 76 || strangeloop - 0, overall 26 | harrybill, top listener no.1 - 24
25. Mobiles Jazzkommando - 76 || 1 listener (me), 0 top listener
Useless to go on in this way, the next 25 artist are showing the same results. I hope, it will help to find the bug.
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dancingmongoose

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3 months is an awfully brief period of time to look at, I'd strongly suggest extending that. Definitely needs to be a recent period of time to prevent it being locked out by inactive accounts but longer than 3 months please
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Andreas_Wotte

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My verification revealed, or let asume, that the measurement period of 3 months must be wrong: I found some top listeners with zero scrobbles in this period before and after the last update. So it can't be effected by deletion of scrobbles. After all, I appreciate an extention too.
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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It's not based on 3 months; but you need to have at least scrobbled in the last 3 months to be included.
(Edited)
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pushistik8

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Hello. I suddenly detected out that now I'm absent in the tops of my favorite artists ... For years I hung there, and suddenly ... I was looking for does anyone also have such a problem, I see that I'm not alone... 

Farther, I right away say, that  it's not about it's not exactly that I did not listen to someone. I was in the top listeners for many years with the same artists, with a lot of artists, and it could not have happened that everything was lost right away. There was an impression that the system punishes me. This is very sad. But I want to believe that it's still some kind of mistake. For a long time I've been watching how compatibility is incorrectly defined - for those users with whom I have low compatibility, it is actually high, so, how else to find like-minded people is impossible, except with the help of Top Listeners. At first I thought that it was somehow connected with the subscription, but in the top there are a lot of those who do not have it.
sorry my english((
thank you, is very respectfully.
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Hans-Jürgen, Moderator

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I don't know what might have gone wrong with your top listeners, but if you want to find like-minded people you could also check  the Last.fm Reddit group where they have an automatic "Bi-weekly Follow Megathread" with people posting their musical taste, so others can follow them if they want:

https://www.reddit.com/r/lastfm/comments/7haxt9/lastfm_biweekly_follow_megathread_03_december_2017/

And the site Tastebuds.fm is still working also relying on your Last.fm profile besides other social network sites like Facebook and Spotify:

http://build.last.fm/item/507
https://tastebuds.fm/faqs

Fun fact: on Tastebuds you actually have to pay for this:

INCOGNITO MODE
  • Hide your online status
  • Visit profiles anonymously
;-)
(Edited)
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Andreas_Wotte

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Hey pushistik8. Because of the bug, Jon asked me for some examples, where I should be a top listener over the last 90 days too. You can see them above. I was expecting, not to be the only one who's excluded. Perhaps you can post some of your last 90 days top artist and the scrobbles, where you should be a top listener too. Post also the last top listener (page 9) and his/her scrobbles during the last 90 days. Maybe that can help the dev team.
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Sachin Mangal, Alum

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There is indeed something strange going on with top listeners. We have a bug ticket to track this issue. I looked at the code that generates toplistener data itself and there is nothing obviously wrong or buggy in the code. The only places I haven't looked is the input datasets but that might take sometime. I will look whenever I can and post my findings here. Thanks for posting the examples.
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Andreas_Wotte

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Thanks for looking into it, though christmas holiday is comming soon.
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Andreas_Wotte

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Hello Last.fm, hi Sachin!
Any news in case of the top listener bug?
Have a successful week.
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Hi Andreas, Sachin has moved on to greater things, and I'm afraid it doesn't look like he found the time to investigate this further. :( 

The bug ticket still exists, so I'll keep that bumped up, but as you know the data team have their hands tied finishing the new scrobble database before April.   I'll ask, but realistically I can't see this moving forward in the meantime. Sorry about that. 

 
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Patrick

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The data team has their hands tied finishing the new scrobble database before April.
Oh-o! So that means we will be able to fix our messy charts. Neat!
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Andreas_Wotte

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Hi Jon. Thanks for your reply. I guess to understand the personnel situation.
Indeed the top listener tool isn't part of the core items. So the decision is comprehensible.
I remember the release date, when James was proud to present this feature as a part of making Last.fm more social again. And now the ranking seems to be a kind of fake.
Well, I would prefer the devs concentration on other socialable things like bbc etc, after you will have finished your work on the new scrobble database.
On the other hand, I'm pretty sure, the top listener issue belongs to more than a few users. Also it looks like the tool has more bugs than to exclude a few people. E.g. obviously the 3 months period doesn't work correct. But there's a ticket for this issue, so I'm looking forward to spring/summer.
(Edited)
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james x

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled Some top listeners don't actually listen to that artist.

3 of the top listeners for "nothing,nowhere." have thousands of scrobbles, but one of them only has 100 and he shows up under the top listeners.
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Patrick

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I hope they will fix the issue. It's impossible to become a top listener of a big band like Type O Negative is for example with a few scrobbles. Here's an example of one user called BjH. He's a top listener of the band Type O Negative with only 168 scrobblers. https://www.last.fm/user/BjH/library/... I can see him on the front page, but I can't see myself who has 4,510 unless I didn't visit the top listeners' page. https://www.last.fm/user/Samson-91/li... How is this possible? He's in the first position with only 168 scrobbles, while I'm in the ninth position with only 4,510 scrobbles. Here's another example, https://www.last.fm/user/TypOnNegatywny/library/music/Type+O+Negative this user has almost 25,000 scrobbles; yet, he's on the second page in the 24th position. https://www.last.fm/music/Type+O+Nega...
(Edited)
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Magdalena

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Hey, I have been listening to these guys https://www.last.fm/music/Faunts since 2011.
How come I am not even in listener pages? (I looked through every single page. BTW there is some issue with it, but I managed to go through it by changing the number in link). I have written about my issue some months ago, but nobody can really explain how come I'm not on a listeners pages to this day. Everything was fine until the site's been changed.

Hope there is some explanation
Cheers.
(Edited)
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Andreas_Wotte

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Magdalena, you have scrobbled Faunts 57 times the last 90 days. The last top listener Sandrob57 only 20 times in this period. So you "should" be a top listener too.
The explanation is this: The reimplemented top listener tool has a bug. Sachin (dev staff) hasn't found it at a first sight.
Unfortunately Last.FM hasn't the personal capacity to care about this issue at the moment. But a good looking site is only great, when it's working as well.
(Edited)
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Magdalena

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Yeah, it's just negligence... everything was fine but somebody had to come up with the idea to change it for worse...I see, and now nobody cares... eh


Thanks for explaining me that.


Those are 57 tracks, but 342 scrobbles - just saying, it's irrelevant anyway. 
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Andreas_Wotte

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I share youre annoyance. Any explanation doesn't solve the problem. And you're right Magdalena: The first time after reimplementation, the top listener tool was working fine. So the not solution-focused, but interesting questions are: "Who has done this", and "what have you done, and why?"
(Edited)
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Patrick

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It's annoying; the top listener tool is not working. Yesterday I was a top listener for these Artists, but today I disappeared:
https://www.last.fm/music/Obituary/+l...
https://www.last.fm/music/Type+O+Nega...
https://www.last.fm/music/Solitude+Ae...
https://www.last.fm/music/Living+in+a...
https://www.last.fm/music/Ratt/+liste...

And the list goes on.

I don't know what is going on here. The widget doesn't function properly. It keeps rejecting most active top listeners by adding new listeners who have a few scrobbles in their library or by adding spammers who have up to 10,000.
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Hi Magdalena, sorry this has taken ages, but we believe we've finally figured out the problem (at least in your case, and probably Andreas' too).  We're not parsing your about me correctly (most likely the quotation marks, hence Andreas has the same problem), which is causing you to be excluded from the top listener charts.  As crazy as that sounds, apparently it has something to do with a check we perform to filter out banned users from the chart.  This is also why there was seemingly no obvious correlation between the users affected and their scrobble history.

There's probably no need to edit your about me - now that we know what the problem is, it's likely to be fixed before we next generate the top listener chart.  Again, I'm sorry it's taken so long to figure out, but hopefully this will solve the issue for good.
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Fix has gone live, and I can see that you're a top listener for Faunts.  

 https://www.last.fm/music/Faunts/+listeners
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Patrick

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BUMP! Can we get an update on this? The user called BjH is a top listener of the popular band Type O Negative with only 168 scrobbles. He's on the second position while I'm on the tenth position with 4,746 scrobbles.
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Nothing's really changed since my last post -- we're aware that it's a problem but we simply don't have the resources to look into this right now.   Sorry for any inconvenience caused by this in the meantime.

Edit: also keep in mind that it doesn't account for deletes.  It's possible that BjH recently scrobbled thousands of tracks by mistake, and then subsequently deleted them from his library, that would explain why he's ahead of you.

Edit: also, you're already ON that page -- the bug is people NOT being listed when they should be.
(Edited)
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Patrick

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Ah, okay.
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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A quick update: we think we've identified the issue (actually there were two problems), so this should be fixed soon.
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Patrick

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Got it.
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ratito jones

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This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled top listeners not showing correctly?.

top listeners for car seat headrest (https://www.last.fm/music/Car+Seat+Headrest) shows the top 4 users, however, upon further inspection,  they dont seem to have the actual top plays for car seat headrest:
https://www.last.fm/user/theSimius only has 414 scrobbles (all time)
https://www.last.fm/user/elfinit only has 146 scrobbles (again, all time)
https://www.last.fm/user/heatherskelters/ has 6909 scrobbles! (all time, and alot, but still behind these guys?)
https://www.last.fm/user/antigolfboys has 6420 (all time)
then i come in, 
https://www.last.fm/user/XnxG with 10167 scrobbles (also all time)

I would like to know whats the sorting algorythm at the very least maybe? then maybe you guys can fix these standings? i really like csh and i like telling my friends im the top listener on last.fm but these other dudes are killing me x.x
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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If there was an issue generating the chart that week, it appears to have been fixed, as this looks ok to me now? https://www.last.fm/music/Car+Seat+Headrest/+listeners

>>>>I would like to know whats the sorting algorythm at the very least maybe? 

Keep in mind that it's not all time scrobbles, but 'recent' scrobbles -- that's why heatherskelters is ahead of you.  To discourage cheating we're not going to say exactly how it works, but it should be fairly easy to figure out if you look at the libraries of the top 1-5. 
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Magdalena

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And what about when you are not on the listeners sites at all? But you've listened to the band for more than 7 years....? I was there, and disappeard after the reconstruction of the network...


https://www.last.fm/music/Faunts/+listeners

I already asked about this issue... and still everyone doesn't give a flying rat's butt about it... 

Bring back the old last.fm... 


nick: magda-333
(Edited)
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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Official Response
We believe this is fixed now -- if there are any remaining issues, please let me know and I can take a look.
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Bethany03

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Hi, this suddenly happened to me today and I am POSITIVE that I listen to these select bands excessively and daily. I didn't even get bumped down - just removed entirely. I have made no changes to my account either and have Spotify linked 24/7.
Any chance I can be reinstated as I am without a doubt these bands top listener?
There are more bands I was removed from in general rankings. I hope I have not been flagged as a bot as these are all legitimate scrobbles.
Please and THANKS!

Acount: Radical03

30 Seconds To Mars (#1 for almost a full 365 days - they are on repeat every day with over 110k plays)
MuteMath (#2/3 spot for the past several months - played daily)
Axwell /\ Ingrosso (#1 spot for months - played daily)
Dead Letter Circus (#1 spot several months - played multiple times daily)
Teacup Monster (#1 past month - played daily)
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Andreas_Wotte

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Thank's for fixing. I'm glad to see, that it's working again.
:-)))
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Jon, Community & Customer Services

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No problem Andreas. Gotta say, this one ranks highly in 'The most obscure bugs on Last.fm'.   Who could possibly have predicted that the quotation marks in your 'about me' was preventing you from appearing on top listeners? 
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Patrick

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Thanks a lot for fixing this issue. I'm glad it's working again, as Andreas_Wotte said.

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