Why did you change the way the 505's fit ?????

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  • Updated 4 months ago
Does anyone know if Levis changed the style of their 505 jeans. I recently tried on 3 pairs and noticed the waist does not come up as high. Almost like a low rise jean. I also ckecked them to the 505's I was wearing (these are about 6 mo's old) and there was approx 1 inch difference between the crotch and the top of the waistband. You could also see the difference in waist height when looking at the rear beltloop to the seam that runs horizontally across the seat.
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Mike

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Posted 4 years ago

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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Mike

It is common to update the fits on an ongoing basis. We base our updates on demand and extensive fit tests with a wide range of consumers, If you aren't happy with the current fit, I would suggest calling our Consumer Relations team (1-800-USA-LEVI and press 3) so that they can find something with the rise you are looking for.

Thanks,
Rosie C.
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walt

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Take a look at Levis, the once American icon with the best made jeans on earth at one time. Stopped making Levis in USA. Outsourced to Mexico, then to Egypt. Now they have change their style to below the waist hip huggers with low grade material.
Levis now cost $40 - $100 a pop for cheap over priced jeans.
Ya think Levis could make better jeans in the USA for cost they are charging now. I think so.
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wpalmiter

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Rosie C. stop drinking the company Kool Aid. I have tried every line you now make and non of them fit even close to the 505 Regular fit. It gave all my new Levis to good will and now I am off to find new jean company
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Rebecca McDonald Rinker

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Brooks Brothers now has a "Classic" line of Levi's made exclusively just for them!! So Rosie Is this the old regular fit 505's? Now selling only at Brooks Brothers for a whopping 148.00??? Seriously?
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Scott

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Don't bother calling. I bought 2 pairs of my old size and the waists stretched to the point it felt like I was wearing hip-hop; they were falling off my tush with room for a fist. Washed in hot water and dried in high heat -- stretched again. Not just the cuts, but the fabrics have changed. When I called Levi's, I was given an address to mail them back subject to Levi's review. I know I was going to be told that nothing was wrong; call me skeptical, but that is American business. Levi's should have sent a pre-addressed, pre-paid label, not an email with an address. I am not going to spend $10-$15 to Levi's only to have the company tell me it's sorry or too bad, Levi's doesn't agree. I just returned them to JC Penny's. I suggest to buy cheap pants, store brands, and save the buck.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Scott

I am sorry to hear you are not pleased with our recent 505® style update. We did adjust them so that the waist and hips are straighter and the rise is slightly shorter. Now the fit is designed to sit lower on the hip. This means you will probably need to order a smaller waist size to get the same fit you have had in the past.

And actually if you contact our Consumer Relations team as I previously advised and request a return, we would allow an exchange for the next waist size smaller to accomidate this fit update.

Thanks,
Rosie C.
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digitect

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Rosie, your recommendation to get a smaller size is deceitful. A smaller size of an already smaller cut jean means still less room in the seat and legs. Give me a break.

The reason 505s have been popular for so long is that they fit men with muscles. Those of us who are athletic or who "work" for a living actually have gluteus and quadriceps. We need *more* space in the seat and legs than the average skinny video game player. This has nothing to do with fat, our waists are normal or smaller than average. We're all talking about the ratio of waist to seat/thigh.

Relaxed fit jeans like the 550 and 560 don't solve the problem either, large flapping pant legs are uncomfortable when you have to bend your legs a lot or work crouched.

I'm guessing Levi's has found through "marketing research" that with the numbers of physically fit Americans continuing to decrease, demand for the original 505 cut is less desirable than making jeans in more fashionable, albeit less practical, cuts.

I accidentally purchased two 505 straight cut pairs before realizing what had happened. No more. This afternoon I'm checking out Wrangler. (Looks like they are more reasonably priced, too.)
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kgreene500

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I also purchased 2 pair 505 Jeans last year. My wife asked me throw the out because I have plumber's crack with them. The pants were uncomfortable and I had to constantly pull them up. I bought a pair of Lees and they are a bit better but the waist is still lower than the old 505 regulars. I have been wearing Levis since about 1969 and have been wearing 505s for a long time. I used to be able to go to the store and be out in 5 min with Jeans. Now I have to find a new brand. I'll try the wranglers and see if they fit. When I find the right Jeans, I will stick with them.
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Larry Howery

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i have bought 505 regular fit,straight leg for almost 30 years and now i can not find same jean even though it says 505 it fits like a hip hugger or low rise,guess i will be buying wranglers,dont look like they care about repeat customers
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Blue Jeans and T-Shirts

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Guys...Just bring back the 'Regular Fit' 505s...If you want to offer a different cut, for heaven's sake, give it a different model number...But don't screw with a classic...

I will not be buying any more Levis unless they can make the 505 regular cuts again...

Disgusted,
Chris
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Scott

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Hello Rosie,

If you read my entire posting, you will see that I said I contacted your customer service. I was told I could send it back and it would be investigated for defects. I am not exaggerating. Your customer service did not give a response that was at all close to your posting. There was no addressing the sizing.

Regardless, the size smaller has not stretched the same way. I bought size 34w, 32 l. Those were slightly snug when I bought them and they were the ones that stretched. I bought one pair of 33w 32 l before your posting; that pair is tight and has not stretched -- it remained the same size after washing and wearing unlike the first two pairs. So, there is a problem in fabric before I was alert to the change in sizing.

Again, please note, your customer service did not respond in the manner you did. I was asked for an email address and was provided a mailing address. My advice to Mike still applies.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Scott
Please accept my apologies for misunderstanding your initial post. In addition I want you to know that your situation was not handled appropriately by our Consumer Relations team and I would like to personally see to it that we rectify this for you. If possible could you please contact me directly or provide me with your contact information so that I can contact you? RCayetano@levi.com or 415-501-7515.

Thanks,
Rosie C.
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Scott

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I don't know your business hours. I will email you separately with an email to contact me with an appropriate time to call. Scott
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Scott
Got your email, I'm available Monday through Friday 9-5 PM (pacific) most days but if you call and miss me just leave a message and I will call you back. I am on email 24/7 if this time frame doesn't work for you.

Thanks for getting back to me!

Rosie C.
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Blue Jeans and T-Shirts

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BRING BACK THE REGULAR CUT 505s!..
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John B. Daukas

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I am new to this thread. I just bought two pair of 505s (36 inch waist) and noticed they ride lower. Do you have a style that is the same fit as the old 505s (higher on the hips)? If not, if I buy a different size, will they feel like my old jeans? If so, 35"? 34"? I hate to go to another brand.

Thanks
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi John
We would hate to see you go to another brand! The 505® was updated so that the waist and hips are straighter and the rise is slightly shorter so you will probably need to order a smaller waist size to get the same fit you have had in the past. Some of our customers are happy switching to the 550 to get the same fit through the waist (higher rise), though the leg and hip are slightly looser in this fit. I would be happy to help you further, email or call me directly: RCayetano@levi.com or 415-501-7515.

Thanks,
Rosie C.
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I've tried the 550s and 501s...They are not the same...For many years, your customers have been happy with the product...Why change that?..Profit margin?..Just raise the price...People will be only agitated for a short while...But to change the entire cut?..Loyal Levis folks, like me, are probably going to have to look at other brands...
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Thanks for you help Rosie. I'm guessing some marketing guru decided it was a good idea to change a product people have been buying for years.

My question is why change the 505's? Can't you just make a 506, or 507, or 723? Pick another number and leave the 505's alone.

I've been buying these jeans for as long as I can remember. I didn't have to shop, just went in and bought the size I wear and the color I like. But no more.

For the rest of you, I bought Kohl's Urban Pipeline Regular fit jeans, and they fit almost exactly like the Old 505's!
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gisela riess ashley

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my husband has worn Levi's for 50 years. We also were unaware they are no longer USA made....so long Levi's! I am going to Kohls tomorrow to check out the Urban Pipeline Regular fit jeans. Thank you.
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rypkemas

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Here i thought my body had changed somehow. I bought two pairs of 505s at Kohls, same size i always buy and they felt horrible. Bend over and crack a smile. Why would you mess with a product that has been so reliable for years. Take a lesson from Coke - don't mess with success.

I have also notices that you can't seem to find the thicker, darker unwashed levis anymore. I want my jeans to last and like to buy the most durable pant, which used to be Levis. I'll be checking out other brands as well. So long Levis.
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Curse you, Levis!..

The 505s were classic...For many years, guys didn't have to 'shop' at the clothing stores...Just look for your size, grab them, and go...Didn't have to think twice...Don't mess with perfection...

I'm going to start buying Lee...
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spunkspaw

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I have switched to Wrangler. To heck with Levis.
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Terry Kay

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I hate the way the new 505s fit as well. Why mess with a great product. I've been buying 505s, 501's for the last 20 years and now yuck! they are no longer the comfortable jean I remember, especially while sitting. Looks like I'll be trying on a pair of Wranglers soon.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Terry
I am sorry our fit update hasn't worked for you. I encourage you to try downsizing in the waist. Most customers that have reached out to me and tried this have been happy. I can assist you in exchanging your ill fitting 505's for a smaller waist size if you contact me directly. RCayetano@levi.com.

Best Regards,
Rosie C.
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Doug Styner

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Sorry, after 40+ years as a loyal Levi's customer, I must now turn to Wrangler's. At least they'll fit me like I expect and not like a butt-cracking teenager (I'm over 50). Levi 505 Straight fit - meet New Coke. Enjoy your increased sales, I know my teenage son is not chomping at the bit to get himself some of those new 505's!
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buhund

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I'm with you. I have a 13 year old. He thinks the quality and fit stinks. Apparently you can't fool all the people all the time!
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Blue Jeans and T-Shirts

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And at 13, he would have been a loyal 505 guy like the rest of us!..
Go ahead, Levis, spoil a good thing...
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Terry Kay

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I appreciate your response Rosie, as you can see many of us guys are somewhat frustrated and wanting to vent extensively. I will contact you directly regarding an exchange. I do have a question though, Would the existing 501 still have the "Regular" fit that we have grown accustomed to on the 505?
or is it slightly different as well? I just don't want another pair of jeans that's like
the hiphuggers of the 70's. Thanks for your time.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Terry
I understand. We haven't updated the 501 recently, so it should have the same fit you are accustomed too. Let me know if you have any other questions!

Best Regards,
Rosie C.
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Brian K

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I am also having the same problem. My issue is the rise is shorter and I feel like my butt is eating the jeans. I don't see how buying a smaller waist size will address the issue of the shorter rise.

I would also like to echo Vinnie's comments. Why change an existing style? Why not keep 505 regular fit and add 506 (or some other number) straight fit?

I am sad to say that as a result of this change I will be looking for another brand of jeans after wearing Levi's for +30 years.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Brian
I hear your frustration and I would like to help you. If you would please email me directly I am confident we can find a good fit solution that will make you happy.

Best Regards,
Rosie C.
RCayetano@levi.com
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mbw

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Hi. Brian K brings up a good question. How does dropping a waste size help in the rise situation? Like he says, the lower rise makes them feel like they are falling off all the time. And if you pull them up, the crotch wedges in your crack. I'll try on some of the other styles (again), but I think Levis has estranged the older crowd in favor of trying to please the kids who want their jeans down around their knees.

Were sales lagging on the 505? Did you change them to address that type of issue? If you changed them for any other reason, that was poor marketing in my opinion. Why mess with something that people like?
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi MBW
I am sorry that you aren't happy with the new 505 fit. We do updates on many of our products from time to time to keep the line fresh and fashionable based on demand from consumers and our retail partners.

If you contact our Consumer Relations department (1-800-USA-LEVI) we will exchange your jeans for the next waist size smaller to accomidate this change. If you aren't interested in this fit solution, we can also suggest current styles that are similar to the older fit.

Best Regards,
Rosie C.
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mmorris3m

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It's looks as though Levi's has failed to listen to the end user and is not trying to fix the their mistake. Levi's, bring back the original 505 and put a different number on the jeans that you are trying to pass off as 505.... If it's not broken then don't mess with it!

This ranks right up there with past corporate mistakes.

The 50's had the Edsel

The 80's had coke changing the formula

21st century with Levi's ruining 505 jeans
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mbw

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I believe you are correct. They are too busy on here trying to defend their actions instead of listening to what we are saying. We tell them that the rise is too low and the jeans are riding up our cracks, so they tell us to buy a size smaller. I understand if the 505 wasn't profitable, then they should kill it, but call the new product something different!!! I'm afraid they have lost a customer in me.
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mmorris3m

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I don't believe that the reason for change was tied to profitability. Someone did not do their research which is most likely some young executive in San Francisco out of touch with the rest of the country. There are just too many people that wear 505 regular fit from all walks of life that I know and have seen wearing. In this economy making a mistake like this is devastating. I would not want to be the one explaining their loss at the share holders meeting.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Again
I am sorry that you aren't happy with our recent fit update. We do care about our customers and I would be happy to help find you a style with a higher rise, or if you would like to try the fit solution I previously suggested I can arrange that as well. Please reach out to me directly so that I can help you.

Best Regards,
Rosie C.
RCayetano@levi.com
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mmorris3m

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Wrangler premium cowboy cut REGULAR FIT jeans are the answer for me. I bought several pairs at Tractor Supply for $34.00 each. Going down a size on the new 505 does not work, it just makes the waist sit even lower. We are wasting are time with Levi's....!
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Didier

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I cannot understand why you replaced the original 505 Regular by another one who doesn't fit. The regular 505 was one of the best. Now the 505 doesn’t exist any more. You should rename it by 50X
I was so happy to find the perfect jeans so now I am really disappointed.
Why did you simply remove the regular? Can’t you keep the regular and also the straight?
You probably don’t care about your customer. Now I need to find another brand.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Didier
I am sincerely sorry that you are disappointed with our fit update. I would be happy to help find you a style with a higher rise, or if you would like to try the fit solution I previously suggested I can arrange that as well. Please reach out to me directly so that I can help you.

Best Regards,
Rosie C.
RCayetano@levi.com
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buhund

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Was any thought given to this major marketing decision? I keep reading about the decline of the Levi's brand and collapse of sales. Doesn't take a genius to understand why. I'd be looking for another job if I were you, Rosie. Unless someone wakes up over there at corporate, the company is doomed.
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Hey Rosie...I respect what you're trying to do - calm down us agitated consumers...But what we really want is the good ol' 505s back...Would'nt you please express to your superiors our utmost dissatisfaction?..
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Donald McCown

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I am extremely frustrated by the changes to the 505's - particularly that there was no announcement, and no change to the label in the earliest part of the changeover. I actually thought I had bought counterfeit Levis, and returned them to the store. I have worn the same size 505's for more than 20 years, and have not tried on a pair in the store for at least a decade. You are losing a very solid niche of older customers - I think you can see that from the thred here. The 550s are not a solution. The legs are way too wide for someone who grew up in your products in the 60's. Bring bakc the 505's and apologize in advertising! Or, please tell me what Lee or Wrangler styles are the match for the 505's. I'm headed there.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi Donald

I am sorry you are unhappy with our recent fit update. We adjusted the name slightly so that the 505 Relaxed Fit is now called the 505 Straight Fit to illustrate the fit change.

Instead of switching to the 550, I would suggest trying a smaller waist size to get the same fit you have had in the past. I have had many customers try this successfully. Please feel free to contact me directly for more information.

Thanks,
Rosie C.
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Blue Jeans and T-Shirts

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A smaller waist size?!? Our complaints are that the seat is too small!..How is a smaller size going to help that?..

What would help is to recommend a Wrangler counterpart...
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walt

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I used to wear Levis exclusively until the low riders came into play. Their was a time when dudes would where their pants with top of butt hanging out, that fad has come and gone. Now I see young and old walkin around in jeans that look like their carrying a big baggy load because the fit is below the waist and they won't stay up. Now they are cheap jeans way over priced. To bad for used to be American icon called Levi Strauss & Co.
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I don't want anyone to see my thong sticking out...But apparently Levis does...
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freshseller

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Hi Rosie,
You apologize repeatedly but do not answer your customer's questions. Please answer this question.
Why not admit there was a mistake by lowering the 505 rise and just have the factories go back to producing with the previous pattern(505's the way they were) and use the new(505 low rise) in a renumberd version? After all you have plenty of numbered versions.
I'm ready to change brands after 30 years as I echo just about every frustrated comment posted here. Please do not apologize and just answer the question.
Thanks,
John
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mmorris3m

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Amen
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi John

I hear your frustration and I do understand your point of view. The main issue that I am trying to address here is that many lifelong customers are trying to find a fit solution that is comparable to the 505 prior to our update. My goal here is providing that solution. I am not in a position to say that changing our fit or the way we categorize it is a mistake and I don't see how that would help you . As with most apparel companies, we update many of our products based on demand and feedback from customers and our retail partners.

If you would like to try some alternatives to our current 505 fit I would be happy to personally help you with that. We do value your business and want you to stay with us. Please feel free to contact me directly so that I can help you: RCayetano@levi.com.

Best Regards,
Rosie C.
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davdevr

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"As with most apparel companies, we update many of our products based on demand and feedback from customers and our retail partners."

There is plenty of demand for the 505 Regular fit and Levis is recieving lots of feedback from dissatisfied customers. What else does Levis need. I'm not one of those flat assed teens that likes to show off their butt crack. Don't mess with success.
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eric

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Can you please tell us specifically the style numbers that most closely approximate the fit of the original 505 Regular Fit jeans? (same/similar rise, same/similar waist fit, etc...)

thanks in advance
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Sure! You have two options:
-Being that we adjusted the fit so that the waist and hips are straighter and the rise is slightly shorter you can try a smaller waist size to get the same fit you have had in the past, this has proven to be very effective with many customers.

or

- Try the 501 or 550, I am including links to them here since we offer them in a variety of finishes:

501: http://us.levi.com/family/index.jsp?c...

550: http://us.levi.com/family/index.jsp?c...
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Blue Jeans and T-Shirts

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WE DON'T WANT A DIFFERENT CUT!..WE WANT THE GOOD OL' 505s BACK!..

If you can't bring them back or express our dismay to your superiors, give us a Wrangler counterpart!..
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Didier

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That's an excellent question. I wear the 505 Regular W33L34 and it would be really great to have the equivalent.
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi there

Being that we adjusted the fit so that the waist and hips are straighter and the rise is slightly shorter you can try a smaller waist size to get the same fit you have had in the past, this has proven to be very effective with many customers.

or

- Try the 501 or 550, here are the links to them here since we offer them in a variety of finishes:

501: http://us.levi.com/family/index.jsp?c...

550: http://us.levi.com/family/index.jsp?c...
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dwmfrancis

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Perhaps I'm just too inexperienced with the language of clothing design; I do not understand how going from a 36W x 36L to a 34 x 36 is going to fix the problem of the rise (distance from crotch to waistband) beng too low on the new 505s. I have the same problem - the last pair of 505's I bought hardly stay up. I was getting ready to buy a pair of suspenders...

df in UT
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Rosie C., Official Rep

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Hi there
I can only tell you that this has been effective for most of my customers that were willing to give it a try. That being said, you can also try our 501 or 550 instead, both provide a straight fit and have a higher rise then that of the current 505.

Thanks,
Rosie C.
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Blue Jeans and T-Shirts

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Please sign this petition and pass it along...

http://www.change.org/petitions/levi-...#
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abeness

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I've skimmed this thread and I'd like to thank Rosie for being receptive to our collective frustration, though I'm disappointed that she's not in a position to truly address the underlying issue, which is that numbers have meaning. I'd love to have a Levi's decision-maker respond as to why numbers apparently no longer have meaning for Levi's. I'm adding my voice in this public forum in the hopes that the issue will be taken more seriously by Levi's.

Like others here, I have been wearing Levi's 505 jeans (size 31W x 32L), for many years. No longer, I guess. Bought two pairs of the usual 31x32 black jeans a couple of months ago. Threw them in the laundry so I could wear them the next day, never dreaming that something marked with a style NUMBER and MEASUREMENTS(!) could be drastically changed. I put a pair on and was disturbed to find that I was swimming in them, yet, like others here, noticed that there was less room in the crotch due to the apparently shorter cut. Had a vague recollection of an article some months ago about bogus waist size labeling among jeans manufacturers (though I somehow never took it seriously), and measured the waist. It was a whopping 34-1/2! That's 3.5 inches bigger than labeled!

Is this extravagant waist size a manufacturing error? Or is Levi Strauss & Co. feeding the obesity epidemic in this country by deliberately oversizing your jeans so that people with waist size X think they still fit into waist X-3 (or X-6)? Good heavens. What on earth are we coming to? Let's retain honesty as a value.

The fabric is much thinner, too. I expect this will significantly reduce durability. It also appears that the nice copper rivets and fastener are gone, now all black. Ick.

I then measured one of my old pairs of 31W x 32L, and the waist of one measured 32 after years of daily wear. I figured maybe they stretched out from the original. Another, newer pair measured 33, and I now understood why they felt too large--a belt could still handle it, though. It didn't occur to me that the "style" might have been "updated" 5 or 6 years ago when I purchased them.

Not only did the new pairs have a 3.5-inch larger waist than indicated on the label sewn to the back, the length of the new pair was significantly longer than that of my old 505 jeans: by a whopping 3.25 inches! Yet it was still marked 32L. You want tall guys to feel shorter? Or am I supposed to now roll up my pants in homage to some other new "gangsta" fad? If you changed the fit to sit lower, I wouldn't expect such a ridiculous inseam length. I've been wearing these jeans on my hips ever since I've been wearing them, and they already sit low. Now there just would be no room for my anatomy.

Come on, Levi's: If you give a style a NUMBER, it indicates to us consumers CONSISTENCY in style. Or at least it did. I now understand that from Levi's perspective, "Style 505" and "31W x 32L" are flexible "concepts", not consistent descriptions of a product. Measurements printed on a product are supposed to mean something. *An inch is not a flexible concept, it's a definable measurement.* I don't want the style that has worked for me for many years to suddenly become some stray 20-something hipster's idea of what "fresh and fashionable" is. Release another style that reflects their new ideas (that's what you used to do), and give them credit if credit is due. Keep it or kill it based on sales. Don't change an existing product that works for a large customer base, merely to reflect the latest fashion trend. That's not what I expect of Levi's and your numbered styles.

If you label a product a 31-inch waist, give me a 31-inch waist. Don't lie! And don't make me lie about my size with a huge label on my butt that says I have a 27-inch waist when it's actually 31 (or 36, or 48; whatever). How the heck am I supposed to buy clothes? Can I no longer trust your sizing, styling, and quality? Please give us back the 505 jeans we've worn for years. Follow the Coke method if you must, and call them "505 Classic".

I can't return these to the store because they've been washed. It looks like I can't trust your sizing or styling any longer. I'm not enthusiatic about the idea of going to the store to try on other jeans to find one that works, then sending these in to you on my dime for an exchange. I hope you have a better idea. I'll call Levi's, but by golly I just need jeans that fit right and last, and it looks like Levi's have gone way downhill since I settled on them years ago.

Can anyone tell me the actual (true) measurements of your various sizes? Or must I jump ship for a manufacturer that is more accurate and honest in their sizing, and hopefully hasn't shaved 3 ounces off the fabric weight to keep the price down?
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mbw

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Here here!!!! Well said abeness.
Photo of Blue Jeans and T-ShirtsBJ

Blue Jeans and T-Shirts

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AGREED!..
Photo of Blue Jeans and T-ShirtsBJ

Blue Jeans and T-Shirts

  • 50 Posts
  • 0 Reply Likes
Please sign this petition and pass it along...

http://www.change.org/petitions/levi-...#