NS7II - Phono preamp input hiss/noise

I tried to connect my Technics 1210 turntable to phono inuput on the rear side. And was badly surprised how hiss/noise was high! Completely useless to work.

Even without a computer, hiss is there. Cables are ok, gnd connected, line inputs work fine, but at the moment i switch the knob above upfader from PC to LINE and from LINE to PHONO on the rear side, hiss appears. Even my MIC has lower noise!

Do you have some explanation?
Here is the detailed video I recorded :
http://youtu.be/QIHM6wEG-lI
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  • Hello,

    Thank you for the very helpful video! Great job! I hope all is well in Serbia!

    Here's what you should do:

    1) Instead of connecting your microphone to MIC2 INPUT, connect it to MIC1 INPUT in the front.
    2) A Mic input will always be a LINE signal, not PHONO. The PHONO signal should only be used if you're using a vinyl turntable. Only channels 1 & 2 can use this feature.
    3) The LINE signal in the back can be use for another mic or when you're connecting a CD player to the rear. Obviously make sure your mixer channels switch is set to LINE as well.

    Follow these directions and this should resolve your issue.
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  • I’m sad
    Thank you Chris, but sorry, this does NOT help!

    To be clear - the issue is NOT with MICROPHONE, the hiss problem is with PHONO input because, yes, I DO WANT to connect my Technics 1210 turntable to Numark NS7II.

    I appreciate your theoretical point of view and willingness to help me, but things are so easy. I need your help, just take one NS7II and do the following and you will have the same poor result as I do...

    1. Shut down Serato DJ. Shut down the computer completely.
    2. Just connect NS7II to the power outlet and headphones to the front panel. You can even disconnect USB cable from NS7II.
    3. On channel 2 set switch to LINE
    4. On rear panel set switch to PHONO for channel 2.
    5. Push up the fader on channel 2 to maximum up.
    6. Enjoy the beautifully terrible hiss on channel 2.

    I tried this test with a friend of mine who also has NS7II and the result is the same, we assume it is related to bad hardware on phono preamp section. And it is not the question about the quality of phono preamp, should it be better or so... There is that much hiss that it is completely useless, except maybe for the kids. And we are talking about possibly the best controler in the world...

    Please, take a look at the photos...
    Am I the first person in the world to discover such a disappointing fact?!

    Please report this to tech guys in Numark, at least they could correct it on NS7III.
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  • Yes, I have the same problem like Aleksandar.
    We bought the equipment last year, but i did not use turntables.
    When Aleksandar told me his problem I started to believe that this is hardware problem with Numark NS 7 II.Can you help us?Please.Thank you
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  • Hello everyone,

    Thanks for the awesome and detailed post above. That was great and very detailed. Great job! I was able to replicate your symptoms. However, there's nothing wrong with your NS7II.

    PHONO and LINE level input are two totally different signals. Notice how your gain knob is turned at maxed volume, of course your going to hear that type of amplification signal when you max out the channel. You shouldn't adjust your gain knob that high anyways. General rule of thumb is to keep your gain level at 12 o'clock and simply adjust your master volume accordingly. For a more detailed explanation between Phono and Line level inputs', click here.

    This DJ controller has been out for over a year now. You don't think anyone else experienced the same thing you did? Of course and they realize that when you properly adjust and connect the NS7II to a turntable, the signal is fine. There's nothing to worry about regarding your NS7II's phono signal. Make sure you're properly adjusted on the NS7II switches and you should be good to go!
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  • I’m disappointed
    Hello Chris D,

    Thanks for the answer and the compliments about my post. This is what I always do, I always try to be awesome :) Otherwise I don't work ;) I have many years of experience behind me, over 25 year as a DJ and radio presenter, also have been working as a beta tester for Visiosonic over a decade ago.

    You are trying to tell me that everything is normal... So you try to claim that it is normal to have so huuuugee hiss on Phono preamp? Sorry, but this answer is not serious when we talk about top class equipment.

    I turned gain knobs to max, just to show you that the hiss is that much high that you can EVEN SEE it !!! On a video in the first post you can see that it is set at around 11 o'clock and the huge hiss is still there.

    I also have a stereo amplifier with phono input and guess what? The hiss level between PHONO and LINE inputs are the same, or at least almost the same! My amplifier is Sansui AU-G77X. Also, tested PHONO input on mixer Allen & Heath Xone 22, also normal, no difference between phono and line. Moreover, I've tried to connect my turntable through special phono preamp before connecting to NS7II and everything was perfect. In other words, if I want a normal phono input, I have to use some other equipment rather than NS7II. Because phono preamp on NS7II is completely useless, not to mention some stronger words.

    So it would have been better to Numark to say that there is no phono input, rather than claiming that they have phono in on NS7II which produces so much hiss. Sorry to say this, I own this unit which is AWESOME :) in all other areas, but connecting phono to NS7II makes no sense at all !!!

    However, thanks for your time, hope Numark will make this properly in the future. I have to go to buy a new equipment for my turntables... :(
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  • Not solved - I just sent mine back to be fixed, the major problem is that the signal to noise ratio on the phono preamp makes it worthless, I also investigated more myself and went to a local music store and tried their floor unit which did the same thing. I will report back when I receive my unit from repair.
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  • I’m hopeless
    Thank you Athertonca for the comment!

    After this, it is obvious that the issue is not related to any particular unit but to the whole generation of NS7II.
    I would love to hear something from Numark tech guys, are they aware of this and are they going to solve it and how? Also, what about us who already have NS7II?

    This machine is marvelous in all other features, it's pretty huge shame to have such a phono preamp at this price range...
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  • I also find it hard to belive we are the only 3 guys to try using a professional turntable with the phono preamp.
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  • I've sent an e-mail to Numark support and they stated they will reply in 72 hours, excluding weekends. No reply so far. I will inform you here if I get the reply within 72 hours.
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  • I’m hopeless
    I received an e-mail from UK Numark support, but they said nothing new and special. Just trying to ask me the same questions I've already described here. Pretty much hopeless so far...
    I replied again and waiting for the response. I am pretty much sure this is the fault of all NS7IIs, not just mine.
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    • I've read your thread DJ Kurve... Sad and irritating story. Fortunatelly I don't have skipping problems at all, since April 2014 when I bought NS7II.

      The main thing which irritates me is the Numark's customer relation. Even when it's obvious that units have some problems (several people here confirmed phono input hiss issue), they don't pay attention and just spin the generic story, check your computer, check this, check that... Like we are novice beginners...

      The main purpose of my question is to help Numark develop even better product in future and they are treating us in a funny way. Is it so hard to admit that there was a failure in production phase???
    • Agree with you 1000% in regards to Numarks customer relations! They treat everyone on this forum like a bunch of kids. Like I stated over in my thread, I strongly believe Numark sold us NS7 II users a lemon. The constant generic replies and overall run around, but no fixes/updates!
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  • I’m indifferent
    Finally I received a kind of a normal reply from Numark on e-mail (Numark UK Support) :

    They say (among everything else) :
    "This would suggest that the problem is unfortunately occurring somewhere within the phono connections of your NS7."

    So definitelly, it IS the problem within my unit.
    Besides, ALL the people who tried the same, experienced the same problem. Although, Numark doesn't want to comment on multiple user's problems, they are talking only about mine.

    So, just for the sake of truth, I would like to ask all the people who own NS7II to try the following (even if they don't have turntables) and just tell me do you hear the hiss :

    1. The switch on top panel on channel 2 to LINE
    2. The switch on the rear panel for ch.2 to PHONO
    ... and the hiss is there (turn up the gain volume)... even without connecting turntable.

    https://d2r1vs3d9006ap.cloudfront.net...

    https://d2r1vs3d9006ap.cloudfront.net...

    Thank you all!
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  • Hello everyone,

    Thanks again for posting! Let's clear everything up for everyone here. I can definitely see why hearing noise on any input would be alarming or confusing, but I can assure you that there’s nothing wrong with your NS7II. The signal that is being used on the phono circuitry, outputs at a higher level than the line circuity. The noise floor level is always going to be louder on a phono input than a line.

    Basically, comparing the noise levels of any inputs without sources playing is irrelevant. As with any audio system, you need to have an input signal to establish the reference level. Naturally, because a phono preamp has far more gain than a line level input, the noise floor will be much higher when the gain is cranked, which you would never do normally.

    Just to be sure, I tested a number of phono output turntables here with a few records into the NS7II. None of them required I turn the gain up beyond about 10 o’clock. The noise floor was undoubtedly not noticeable at this point.

    I didn't notice you playing a record from your 1210 on the video, but if you find you have to turn up the gain all the way with records from the 1210, here are some possibilities.

    * The cartridge output is lower than it’s normal level, perhaps due to age.
    * The RCA cables from the 1210 to the NS7II are too long; unbalanced RCA cables quickly lose signal strength the longer the cable is (keep it under 5ft when possible).
    * Although a much smaller factor in comparison, the needle’s tracking force can also affect volume output and signal to noise ratio.

    Lastly, on page 6 of your NS7II User Guide (not the Quick Start Guide) marked in yellow, it states "Important: Do not set more than one channel's Input Selectors to Mic2; doing so can cause unwanted feedback or distortion." I know your not doing this but keep this in mind in case if you decide to use your Mic2.



    I hope all this clears things up for everyone!
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  • I’m disappointed!!!
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    Chris,

    May I ask you why did you mark this post as solved?

    You are responsible Numark's person in this forum and you can do whatever you like with my posts and this thread, but I've saved this communication and did the printscreen and I will share this story somewhere else with even more people (and I am a person with high influence and strong connections with other professional DJs). And I know what I am talking about.

    It is not fair and responsible to claim that everything is fine with my unit when even UK Numark support stated that it is obvious there is a problem within my unit. They suggested me to bring the unit to the service center! Moreover, other people also have the same problem. Every person I contacted discovered the same problem! 100% failure confirmation so far! Too much to be just a simple mistake or a random case.

    Please don't tell me stories about my turntable because it is in excellent condition, factory cables and a brand new Ortofon Concorde Pro S Set. Besides my turntable works perfectly fine with other phono preamps and external mixers. My other turntable Technics SL-D2 also shows the same thing. How is it possible that my equipment works properly with all other products (REGA Fono Mini A2D phono preamp and Xone 22 mixer) without any hiss and only with NS7II it has terrbile hiss? Any logical answer on this???

    And I am quite sure you people in Numark are also aware of this, but instead of helping, your only goal is to close the thread and mark it as
    solved. It is not professional and it is very bad for Numark reputation.

    Wish you all the best!
    Aleksandar
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  • This reply was removed on 2015-04-08.
    see the change log
  • This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled I'm experiencing a phono hiss noise with my NS7II.

    In keeping with the 100% failure rate, my NS7II also has the terrible phono hiss noise. Here we have a genuine production fault. The Numark staff are so reluctant to admit there is a fault, they would rather spin some generic and irrelevant suggestions in order to dodge the issue.

    Make no mistake - this is a real fault! It is NOT solved!

    In summary:
    - Numark's quality assurance team did not test the phono inputs.
    - Numark's marketing team continue to advertise the NS7II as an "audiophile-grade" stand-alone mixer, even though users have reported faults with this feature.
    - Numark's first-line support team refuse to acknowledge the user-reported faults, and they are reluctant to pass faults on to engineers.
    - Numark's product manager is happy to ignore old faults in order to focus on brand new products. Because that's where the $$$ is at!

    If you want to work for Numark, all you have to do is put a smile on your face and stick your head in the sand :))

    Note: This conversation was created from a reply on: NS7II - Phono preamp input hiss/noise.
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